[Divorco]

More women are attending college than men, and marriage rates are down. There are two competing explanations. One is that as women have prospered economically, they no longer need male providers. Alternatively, as men can get sex with game, they no longer need to become husbands. The article concludes

Instead of making marriage more attractive, he said, it might be better for society to help make men more attractive.

But actually, evidence indicates that marriage rates drop and unmarried births rise with a shortage of men.

NYTimes

[dragnet]

Hamsters, predictably, out in force in that NYT comment thread. A sight to behold.

[Asaxon]

...ever tried outrunning someone else while having a 10 pound rock tied to your leg? The educational system has been skewed for decades to give females a leg up while punishing males. The same is true for standardized tests that include more and more "soft subjects" instead of hard facts and logic.

[void]

the comments are full of hamsters

Quote:

NYT pick:
I think most women (if hetero) would welcome the opportunity to raise children in a secure relationship with a man. But if the prospects are low, with the available men not willing to commit and be stable partners and job holders, we shouldn't be surprised to see women opting to raise kids on their own. Given how difficult it can be financially and otherwise to raise kids as a single mom, it should be apparent that women are doing so only because as hard as it is, it seems preferable to the alternative of pairing off with the available men.

This is especially so for women who are not as well educated. It has been shown that in recent years there is more pairing off between partners at higher levels of education. The Ivy league marries fellow Ivies and so forth. What this leaves women with who perhaps have degrees from lower level colleges or only HS diplomas is often men who are not going to make good partners.

At the same time we also need to look at whether or not our benefit programs encourage single mom households. If this is the case, many women will opt to not marry or commit to their children's father in order to obtain more services.

yeah, its a shame that there a not enough ivy league men for every hamster

[The Pumpkin King]

Haven't enough bloggers gone over this? Why would any man be motivated to bust his ass for a house, car, or food, when the main reason for hard earned achievement was supposed to be a slim, dutiful, attractive, and feminine wife? Females in modern society completely ignore all of our needs, while also wanting everything from us. Most males are content living in a sub-par apartment, just making ends meet. When you have unlimited entertainment, and humanity is at a point where we don't have to work just to live the next day, why would you want to spend hours working hard to pay car insurance. Secondly, as male in college getting close to the age of 30, I can tell you that almost half the classes I took, unrelated to my major, are just straight shaming indoctrination classes.

[megatron]

Plus, men on average still make more, because we're built to do tougher, more physically and mentally taxing work. So I don't really think we're in that much trouble anyway. Society sure is, because thousand and thousands of American men are realizing that they'd rather live their lives single and without the chains of a bossy, disrespectful, anchor of a wife.

I'm worrying more for the women. They've been given everything in the States over the past 50 years and they're even MORE unhappy now. They're the that spoiled, rude little shit in Toys R Us bitching out their Mom to buy them the latest, gory video game for $60 bucks.

And most of them don't even have the self-awareness to understand that they're mostly at fault for the hole they've dug themselves into.

[Divorco]

(03-20-2013 02:10 PM)The Pumpkin King Wrote:  

almost half the classes I took, unrelated to my major, are just straight shaming indoctrination classes.

Now I'm aggravated. Why would you waste your time on those classes? Were all the STEM classes full? I see conservative bloggers like David Horowitz complain about Marxist professors. But you rarely find them in economics departments, and never in business schools.

[cardguy]

MarginalRevolution (the best economics blog around) are covering this. I just started reading the comments and it is nice to see alot of Red Pill comments:

http://marginalrevolution.com/marginalre...round.html

I like Tyler Cowen (who runs the blog). But he is very PC at times. I remember him once refusing to link to a Roissy blog post despite commenting on it. That is pretty bad manners on the internet. Then again - most academics are PC and Blue Pill. So it is not so surprising.

[MikeCF]

(03-20-2013 03:00 PM)cardguy Wrote:  

MarginalRevolution (the best economics blog around) are covering this. I just started reading the comments and it is nice to see alot of Red Pill comments:

http://marginalrevolution.com/marginalre...round.html

I like Tyler Cowen (who runs the blog). But he is very PC at times. I remember him once refusing to link to a Roissy blog post despite commenting on it. That is pretty bad manners on the internet. Then again - most academics are PC and Blue Pill. So it is not so surprising.

That's where I first heard of Roissy's blog. Probably never would have seen it otherwise.

TC = white knight, but his attempt to shave Roissy for being evil worked to my benefit.

[cardguy]

Funnily enough. I think that is the first time I came across Roissy as well! So I really shouldn't complain.

[Veloce]

IMO a lot of MGTOWers and MRAs are being too "wordy" about their "cause" or whatever. We're men. We don't need to provide explanations for our behavior.

If anyone runs across any shaming whatsoever in their daily life, simply take a deep breath, correct your posture, stand straight, tall and proud, look your subject in the eye, and state firmly, "Why the fuck should I?"

Out there in the wilderness, it's this cacophany of:

"omg youre 30 something and unmarried and omg are you a player? can I trust you what kind of car do you drive what do you do, do you want kids, we have a free phone upgrade for you 2 year contract required what school did you go to labor day sale only 49.99 per month is that a pickup line? We need a bigger apartment a bigger TV a better vacuum cleaner you never compliment me anymore you're not romantic what are you thinking? You've stopped going to church why didn't you vote sign up for new pre-approved credit only 9.99% APR."

Whether someone is trying to sell you something, convince you of something, or shame you into doing something, repeat the above treatment. Stand tall and straight, look them in the eye, and speak from the chest, "Why the fuck should I?"

If modern men used this as our collective mantra, we could get more shit done and change the game. I think it's catching on.

[Ensam]

Men are losing economic ground because there's just no incentive.

I'm one of the few who's arguably done quite well. I have Ph.D., relatively highs status job, nice pad, I travel, etc. None of that has really made any differences with the ladies besides some chicks who have an almost fetishistic attitude towards dudes with doctorates.

Why bust your ass to gain status and riches if it doesn't change the type of girl you can pull? A lot of dudes are perfectly happy pulling down 30-60k/year and living a modest lifestyle. The only reason they'd try harder is if there was pussy at the end of the tunnel. It's just not there anymore. If girls started to reward economic success with easy access to poon dudes would become so productive the economy would fix itself in 6 months.

[Kingsley Davis]

Operation Depopulation/Emasculation going according to plan.

   

[teh_skeeze]

I really wish these assholes would stop using the word "education" and call it what it really is, indoctrination. I only had one teacher whose class required you to form an opinion of your own. Then he would destroy your ideas just to force you to think about them.

I'm a prime example of the American "education" system. I was arguably one of the smartest kids in my school. I got A's on all of my tests (one teacher used to separate me from the rest of the class to keep people from cheating off me), but had a sub 1 GPA because I never did homework. I will probably be poor my whole life because people look at my shit and think I'm a deadbeat. However, the people I actually get to look in the eye and shake hands with think I'm one of the smartest/hard working people on the face of the Earth. I got a job that wound up not working out in the end by talking international politics with an old businessman. The same topic would have landed me in DC as a congressional aide, if only the guy we met with had gotten past the primaries. People are shocked when I tell them I only took one semester of college.

These days you have to prove you are a good slave before you can be a slave.

[Ovid]

Men are, by and large, realizing that there is no point to the rat-race. Not all men realize this, but enough to make a statistical difference. Women, on the other hand, are ever increasingly running to join the rat race and get as high and far as they possibly can, because their women's lib moms and feminist teachers in high school told them that's what they needed to do. Accordingly, institutions are increasingly skewed to favor women, which makes men less likely to succeed.

Nowadays, a classical liberal arts education isn't about learning philosophy and thinking over profound ideas, then applying those ideas to practical subjects to advance human learning (what it was about when men designed and ran it.) Now, it's about bemoaning inequality of all kinds (class, income disparity, race, gender, sexual orientation...) and seeing who can act the most outraged during the day, while indulging in debauchery at night. Not that debauchery is bad, per se, but going to university now has little in common with going to university a hundred years ago. Girls decide to prioritize career over marriage by going to college, and then feel free to slut it up with the guys in their historically-male institution. It's manageable for a girl to hold the hormones in check for a few years until marriage at 18 or 20 when she's living at home and her parents and neighbors won't approve of promiscuity, but much harder when she knows she won't get married for a good long time and she's away from home, horny, with a lot of guys who will readily ply her with alcohol.

Feminist propaganda creates sluts and career women, and the two trends feed off one another. There is no complementary trend to encourage men to take on the world and work hard, and the growth of the woman trend makes the men superfluous (can't buy pussy with a stable job and house anymore) so a lot of guys can't be bothered to get off the couch and turn off the X-box.

[Hotwheels]

(03-20-2013 06:00 PM)teh_skeeze Wrote:  

I really wish these assholes would stop using the word "education" and call it what it really is, indoctrination. I only had one teacher whose class required you to form an opinion of your own. Then he would destroy your ideas just to force you to think about them.

I'm a prime example of the American "education" system. I was arguably one of the smartest kids in my school. I got A's on all of my tests (one teacher used to separate me from the rest of the class to keep people from cheating off me), but had a sub 1 GPA because I never did homework. I will probably be poor my whole life because people look at my shit and think I'm a deadbeat. However, the people I actually get to look in the eye and shake hands with think I'm one of the smartest/hard working people on the face of the Earth. I got a job that wound up not working out in the end by talking international politics with an old businessman. The same topic would have landed me in DC as a congressional aide, if only the guy we met with had gotten past the primaries. People are shocked when I tell them I only took one semester of college.

These days you have to prove you are a good slave before you can be a slave.

We sound very similar.

Do your own thing. It's more gratifying and doesn't depend so much on educational background.

I don't work well for others, so it's almost mandatory for me.

[Basil Ransom]

1. Maybe part of it is a simple check your ass thing. No one's going to get sued for not hiring enough men. But if you don't hire enough women, Holy shit! GET GLORIA ALLRED. Your ass is about to get sued. I worked in a store where upper body strength was imperative for half the work, yet half the staff was still chicks, and the men were still responsible for all the duties.

2. Most men love the idea of having a girl around - look at how many guys feel cool just because they have female friends.

3. The whole job interviewing process is subjective and phony. You have multiple candidates who are all roughly comparable, and hey, one's a babe. The hiring manager scratches his balls, and says, eh, why not? A coworker of mine said he'd do exactly that.

4. I recall seeing a study somewhere that HR people (who are mostly women) discriminate against men. I mean, socially, you see women shitting on men and telling other women how great they are, and weak men do the exact same thing. Unless the girl is ugly or obviously under-credentialed, she's got an advantage by default.

[solo]

Another reason can be that today's white-collar jobs are increasingly about getting in line, take order and not be confrontational etc. As opposed to before when aggressiveness and physical strengths were more important.

Girls are also more easily fooled to think that a career and money-making is the be all and end all in life. Of course this idea serves government and the big corporations. Men are more likely to be sceptical and not want to work for other men (or women).

I'm def not saying that a career is necessarily bad though. But it does imply sacrificing a big part of your freedom, at least for several years.

[kdolo]

the game is rigged in order to produce exactly what it is producing:

1. less family formation
2. less children
3. more malleable slave like workforce: women/gays
4. disenfranchised economically weakened men i.e. potential warriors-dissidents-threats

thanks Mr. Rockefeller !

[babelfish669]

Any one consider another alternative explanation: women are bad at math.



I graduated from high school almost a decade ago. At that time I would not have gone to college if I had to pay for it. The numbers made no sense. Today, are you fucking kidding?

The women are getting the shit end of the stick, and the lucky few will con some sad dude in to marriage to absorb their student loan debt.

[cardguy]

I think women are biologically incapable of being truly happy.

So - don't sweat it guys.

If you were lucky enough to be born on to team XY you have got it made. I would take being an 'unsuccessful' man over being a 'successful' woman any day of the week/month/year/decade/century/millenium/era/epoch.

[Divorco]

(03-20-2013 05:19 PM)Ensam Wrote:  

some chicks have an almost fetishistic attitude towards dudes with doctorates.

Where do you find them?

[Tytalus]

What amazes me is such such social scientists and economists can't make the connection to high school. I work in a University in Institutional Research, and I can tell you the reason why:

By grade 12 boys and girls performance is so different it really doesn't matter a whole lot what we do. We're gonna get 60 to 70% female population overall with a huge focus of girls in the arts. Boys still dominate the sciences.

People want to "fix" men? They better start taking a long and hard look at primary to high school education system.

[teh_skeeze]

(03-20-2013 07:37 PM)Hotwheels Wrote:  

(03-20-2013 06:00 PM)teh_skeeze Wrote:  

I really wish these assholes would stop using the word "education" and call it what it really is, indoctrination. I only had one teacher whose class required you to form an opinion of your own. Then he would destroy your ideas just to force you to think about them.

I'm a prime example of the American "education" system. I was arguably one of the smartest kids in my school. I got A's on all of my tests (one teacher used to separate me from the rest of the class to keep people from cheating off me), but had a sub 1 GPA because I never did homework. I will probably be poor my whole life because people look at my shit and think I'm a deadbeat. However, the people I actually get to look in the eye and shake hands with think I'm one of the smartest/hard working people on the face of the Earth. I got a job that wound up not working out in the end by talking international politics with an old businessman. The same topic would have landed me in DC as a congressional aide, if only the guy we met with had gotten past the primaries. People are shocked when I tell them I only took one semester of college.

These days you have to prove you are a good slave before you can be a slave.

We sound very similar.

Do your own thing. It's more gratifying and doesn't depend so much on educational background.

I don't work well for others, so it's almost mandatory for me.

Doing my own thing is what has put me into my situation. I have many hobbies and interests. I can't think of a single one that is profitable. Although I am working on something that could be a million dollar idea, I just don't know if it is legal.

My problem isn't working for others. It's the lack of respect that higher ups try to give me. If I am given respect, I am loyal to a fault. Once I feel I can't trust the person I'm working for, I start showing up to work high and half-assing shit. Kinda like I have going on right now. Except that I can't show up high because I drive for a living. I'm not one to put other people's lives on the line.

This is another issue with the way our education system is set up. You are not only stratified by your place in society, but also your educational background. Almost like a caste system where if you are on the bottom, everyone feels the right to shit on you. Unless you are in a victim class, then you are pitied and get handouts.

I try to not worry about it though. The other day I was listening to Leykis and he was going on a long rant about losers in poverty and what have you. I started to feel it personally because it was like he was saying that I'm not worthy of a woman's affection because of my job and living situation. Then I remembered that he's been married and divorced several times and I'm currently banging a married chick who still lives with her social worker husband that she never fucks. Who is the loser now?

Off topic: Now that I typed that out. I wonder if any of Leykis' ex-wives cheated on him with some bartender or something. Would certainly explain the vitriol towards men who are in or near poverty.

[Vitriol]

(03-20-2013 07:27 PM)Ovid Wrote:  

Feminist propaganda creates sluts and career women, and the two trends feed off one another. There is no complementary trend to encourage men to take on the world and work hard, and the growth of the woman trend makes the men superfluous (can't buy pussy with a stable job and house anymore) so a lot of guys can't be bothered to get off the couch and turn off the X-box.

I think this is the most important omission from the original article. The NY Beta Times is (as are all mainstream publications) unwilling to acknowledge that:

1. Marriage isn't a good deal for American men anymore. There's simply no incentive for guys to marry a girl as opposed to just trying to get laid regularly.

2. American women think that their male peers who actually have their shit together and have good jobs are either "boring" or "not good enough for them" and a million other bullshit excuses they think of without ever looking inward and realizing they provide no value themselves. They're just vacuums for resources - which plays into point 1. above.

3. Single mothers are going to have a hell of a time getting any guy to commit to them. Obvious, I know, but unmentioned in the original article.