[Ringo]

This recent post from Roosh on ROK touches on a subject which has been on my mind for quite some time:

Quote:

A man can only achieve the top of his society, not another’s. A French musician can produce the finest of French music that is deeply enjoyed by his peers, but he will never produce music that is enjoyed by Chinese people.

Coincidentally, I was having a conversation with a friend who is a professional musician and that was exactly what his argument was like. "We are brazilians, we were born to play samba. We can try to play blues, but we will succeed as much as an american playing samba" and "If it's not in your blood, not in your culture, there's only a certain level to which you can get."

I tend to disagree to a certain extend, as some of the commenters do, especially under the light of globalization, but I would love to hear what you guys think of the subject. Please no race drama.

[Walderschmidt]

(02-10-2013 07:03 PM)Ringo Wrote:  

This recent post from Roosh on ROK touches on a subject which has been on my mind for quite some time:

Quote:

A man can only achieve the top of his society, not another’s. A French musician can produce the finest of French music that is deeply enjoyed by his peers, but he will never produce music that is enjoyed by Chinese people.

Coincidentally, I was having a conversation with a friend who is a professional musician and that was exactly what his argument was like. "We are brazilians, we were born to play samba. We can try to play blues, but we will succeed as much as an american playing samba" and "If it's not in your blood, not in your culture, there's only a certain level to which you can get."

I tend to disagree to a certain extend, as some of the commenters do, especially under the light of globalization, but I would love to hear what you guys think of the subject. Please no race drama.

I think it is a combination of two things:

1. It is all in people's head's. Maybe if a white American played really good samba, Brazilians would appreciate him. But I don't think that they would ever accept him as a better Samba player than the best Brazilian Samba player. It is a matter of cultural pride you could say.

2. As a Samba player, perhaps it is not possible for the aforementioned American to play the best Samba possible. Maybe if he learns it having not grown up in Brazil or learning it from Brazilians as an American, he misses certain nuances that allow a Brazilian audience to connect with his work.

How does that sound?

[Menace]

I bet that a great musician (for example) from one culture can produce music from another culture (after practice of course) that would be at or near the top level for that type of music BUT only in blind play, i.e. the audience does not see the performer. As soon as they recognize that he is not their own, they will immediately think something is wrong with the music...this is Walderschmidt's point 1.

[Basil Ransom]

(02-10-2013 07:03 PM)Ringo Wrote:  

This recent post from Roosh on ROK touches on a subject which has been on my mind for quite some time:

Quote:

A man can only achieve the top of his society, not another’s. A French musician can produce the finest of French music that is deeply enjoyed by his peers, but he will never produce music that is enjoyed by Chinese people.

Coincidentally, I was having a conversation with a friend who is a professional musician and that was exactly what his argument was like. "We are brazilians, we were born to play samba. We can try to play blues, but we will succeed as much as an american playing samba" and "If it's not in your blood, not in your culture, there's only a certain level to which you can get."

I tend to disagree to a certain extend, as some of the commenters do, especially under the light of globalization, but I would love to hear what you guys think of the subject. Please no race drama.

Depends how you phrase it - generally, your Brazilian friend is correct. A Brazilian man may play the violin or write differently than a Polish man would.

But there are always a few exceptions - men who are not Brazilian but are more Brazilian than the average Brazilian. Or the Brazilian man who is out of touch with his nation's psyche. Arnold Schwarzenegger is the perfect example - he's more quintessentially American than most Americans, yet obviously did not grow up here. There are plenty of men who find little success in their own country, and great fanfare in others. 'We're big in Japan.' Moreover, the differences between individual performers will often swamp international differences.

Historically, people would talk of national and ethnic characters - that people of certain places and bloodlines were predisposed to behaving a certain way. That belief is considered rude nowadays, but it's not clear that it's factually wrong.

[WestIndianArchie]

If that were truly the case, most American music wouldn't spread like it has.

WIA