rooshvforum.network is a fully functional forum: you can search, register, post new threads etc...
Old accounts are inaccessible: register a new one, or recover it when possible. x


Morals
#1

Morals

Does anyone feel bad about mistakes they have made? Maybe I am just being too introspective, but I am feeling really immoral and guilty recently. I am such a loser. I have dropped out of college, was kicked out of the military, am divorced, have had over 80 jobs, haven’t seen my family since 1996, live on women, have cheated on girlfriends, lied on my resume, haven’t filed my income taxes for years, worked in foreign countries on travel visas, tried marijuana, stole some food from employers, have been arrested for domestic violence, and have defaulted on $80,000 of debts. A long time ago, I used to think I was
conservative and ethical, but now I just feel like a bad person. I am so depressed. I am not even sure if I can fix my mistakes.

Do you ever feel guilty about things you have done? What skeletons do you have in your closet? Any advice?
Reply
#2

Morals

Wow, you got shit to work on man. Good luck.
Reply
#3

Morals

Why can't you just be nice?

Aloha!
Reply
#4

Morals

wow! You have lived an interesting life my friend. Unless you are dead you still have time to change.

Rob
Reply
#5

Morals

Oh my God, you tried Marijuana, you are truly a horrible person!! Is this a joke? Common on man, there is something called karma, just don't be a dick and fuck people over and you'll be straight.
Reply
#6

Morals

Quote: (04-02-2010 04:04 PM)weblinks Wrote:  

Does anyone feel bad about mistakes they have made? Maybe I am just being too introspective, but I am feeling really immoral and guilty recently. I am such a loser. I have dropped out of college, was kicked out of the military, am divorced, have had over 80 jobs, haven’t seen my family since 1996, live on women, have cheated on girlfriends, lied on my resume, haven’t filed my income taxes for years, worked in foreign countries on travel visas, tried marijuana, stole some food from employers, have been arrested for domestic violence, and have defaulted on $80,000 of debts. A long time ago, I used to think I was
conservative and ethical, but now I just feel like a bad person. I am so depressed. I am not even sure if I can fix my mistakes.

Do you ever feel guilty about things you have done? What skeletons do you have in your closet? Any advice?

I think we are ALL guilty of lying on a resume man. Some folks like to call it fluff, but it's still a lie.

So, if you have a profession with incredibly stiff competition, then putting yourself in the best light possible is a must.

A resume is made to get you an interview only. You are the ine that gets the job, and if chosen, keeping it is another story.

Now, a dishonorable discharge from the army. Dude you're fucked.

Divorce? Half the guys on this board are probably divorced and cheating on someone.

Marijuana? Who hasn't tried marijuana. Seriously.

Arrested fir domestic violence. You're fucked in this one too!

My advice:

your dishonorable discharge and arrest record are fucking you from every angle. I'd have to guess that your credit is likely in the toilet as well.


Find a new country, do some recon missions and eventually move there and start over. You never know the love of your life may be waiting.

Life has a reset button. Push it!
Reply
#7

Morals

Quote: (04-03-2010 07:12 AM)MiXXmaster27 Wrote:  

Find a new country, do some recon missions and eventually move there and start over. You never know the love of your life may be waiting.

Life has a reset button. Push it!

Great quote man, I'm gonna file this one under back up plan. ha.

coffee is for closers.
Reply
#8

Morals

Good points.

This is just an observation, but I think that most people only think immoral activities are wrong if that person doesn't do it. A person who drinks beer will not criticize another beer drinker, for example, but straight people look down on gays and Christians think atheists are sinners.
Reply
#9

Morals

There is no "right" without wrong. Just like you wouldn't know what light was without dark. One can't exist without the other, and therefore the balance of your behavior has to be weighed and not just the list of your malfeasances. Is there no good that has come from your list?

Think about it.

You were dishonorably discharged from the military, but maybe that means you didn't have to kill some scared Iraqi soldier and father of three, for no reason.

Have you learned any lessons that enable you to be a more empathetic and effective human being?

I know some very successful and upstanding people on paper, that are complete scumbags and shameful human beings in real life. Conversely, there are people who have been dealt a bad hand in life that are a credit to humanity.

A lot of the stuff you listed isn't that bad, and is more of a result of trying to scratch out a means of survival in todays world. For some its easier that for others, and their success or failure is largely not due to a moral or other conscious decision to be good or bad humans. A lot of success is based upon both chance and upbringing / education.

Your also putting a lot of moral weight on some trivial shit. The domestic abuse thing exempted. However, I'm sure there is more to that story then you tell here.

I don't agree that starting over in another country is your only good option, but it is an option.
Reply
#10

Morals

"A long time ago, I used to think I was
conservative and ethical, but now I just feel like a bad person. "

Maybe real life has broken you of the simplistic brainwashing that teaches that "conservatism" equates to ethics. And that "non-conservative" behavior equates to lack of ethics. Life is not that black and white, and paying bills and being financially successful is not "conservative" behavior any more than being poor is socialist behavior.

It seems that conservatives are happy as long as they wouldn't benefit from social services. But as soon as they are down and out, they want the support that social policies offer. That is one reason why "conservatism", as its preached today, is the party of the rich. Anyone who is not rich would statistically benefit from a measured degree of socialism. Middle class and poor people that support the conservative party are nothing but sell-out house boys/girls, that in reality, are too unintellectual to think through the practicality of their political views.

As a side note, I find that most modern "conservatives" have either a selective idea, or no idea, about what true conservatism is. It has nothing to do with the values that you allude to being conservative.
Reply
#11

Morals

I am not sure I understand. Are you saying poor people should be liberal Democrats? I think poor
conservative Republicans think all people should be reponsible for themselves and not social leeches. Poor conservatives may like small government and think they might get rich one day and won't want to pay high taxes in the future.
Reply
#12

Morals

Quote: (04-06-2010 02:03 PM)weblinks Wrote:  

I am not sure I understand. Are you saying poor people should be liberal Democrats? I think poor
conservative Republicans think all people should be reponsible for themselves and not social leeches. Poor conservatives may like small government and think they might get rich one day and won't want to pay high taxes in the future.

Yes, I am saying poor and middle class people should support politicians that forward socially oriented policies, and other policies that truly benefit the many (their constituents) vs the few (their corporate donors). There are bad democrats and bad republicans when critiqued through this lens. However, the democrats do have a better record of doing what is just for the majority of the people vs the few. But its nowhere near perfect. Its just miles better than the republicans.

I don't like 99.9% of all politicians, because I believe that they ultimately all act out of self interest vs that of service to their constituents. The exceptions are very few and far in-between in both parties. Although, I also realize that some actions are a part of staying in the game for them, other actions are inexcusable.

Blind support of any party just demonstrates the lack of will or ability to think for yourself.

It remains an undeniable, historically proven, and timeless economic fact that as the population increases in a capitalistic system, poverty keeps increasing relative to the cost of living, and the quality of life for most people WILL keep declining. This fact is a force of economics that is out of the control of everyone, including politicians.

You HAVE to understand that capitalism works best in small uncrowded populations, and works less well for most people (but much better for the top 5% of the rich) the bigger the population gets. It has the effect of making the vast majority of people poorer and the small percentage of rich richer, over time.

The more people that exist in a specific area, the more competitive it is. Put 2 rats in a cage with some food and observe. Then put 10 in the same cage, with the same amount of food, and watch them eat each other. Population growth affects everything and everybody on a fundamental quality of life level. Conservative anti-intellectuals and politicians love to support big family growth (philosophically – although not practically - a socialist value, for votes) and capitalism at the same time. I say they are anti-intellectual because the incompatibility of these two values is as plain as your hand in front of your face. People who blindly support the neo-conservative party don’t see its hypocrisies that adversely affect everyone, except the very rich. That is very frustrating for people who do. To make things worse, we don't even have a pure capitalist system, but a rigged corporatist system that makes it even harder for the nine little rats to compete with the one big rat in the cage, then of natural selection were to be unrestrained in that cage.

I dont deny that its the natural order of things ie: in nature. The strongest individuals survive. There, population limits itself based upon available resources. Furthermore, the big moose in the forest isn't going to gather a bunch of moose money and hire a moose army and moose cops to enable his further accumulation of food, territory, and other resources that are beyond his natural physical ability to accumulate for himself. But human business people and politicians can and will leverage other humans for unlimited control and power to the detriment of the many. There has to be controls to prevent these actions from affecting the quality of life of the many. Only socialist policies can provide for this.


The only two solutions are:

1. Stop population growth and allow it to go into decline.

Unfortunately, the political conservative manipulation...ahem...support of fundamental religious voters, and support of big businesses' interest in cheaper labor, dictates that they support social policy that propagates further population growth.

2. As the population grows, continue to implement socialist policies that provide for the basic welfare of the many (as in healthcare) and prevent them from being abused unjustly by those in power. Abuse includes labor practices, lending practices, dilution of educational standards, degradation of prison conditions, deletion of human and civil rights, conscription into corporate sponsored wars, and anything else that prevents the poor from having a legitimate shot at living a free and happy life.

That’s what the poor should support.

See if that compares with the manipulative and pseudo-libertarian BS that the conservatives preach to you to get your vote.

By the way, I’m a libertarian on principle.

But I’m also a pragmatist. With an exponentially growing population, there is little choice as to the steps society needs to take.
Reply
#13

Morals

I am a Libertarian-Republican. Doesn't a rising tide float all boats? Look at US growth compared to socialist European growth. The USA believes in survival of the fittest and being responsible for yourself. I am afraid socialism might lead to Communism. I don't know of many people who would want to live in a Soviet Union or North Korea. I think a government who governs the least, governs the best. Welfare makes people lazy and someone will need to pay the bills.

I do worry about population growth, but low birth rates are more the result of wealth and not politics. Compare Japan to Mexico, for example.
Reply
#14

Morals

Quote: (04-02-2010 04:04 PM)weblinks Wrote:  

Does anyone feel bad about mistakes they have made? Maybe I am just being too introspective, but I am feeling really immoral and guilty recently. I am such a loser. I have dropped out of college, was kicked out of the military, am divorced, have had over 80 jobs, haven’t seen my family since 1996, live on women, have cheated on girlfriends, lied on my resume, haven’t filed my income taxes for years, worked in foreign countries on travel visas, tried marijuana, stole some food from employers, have been arrested for domestic violence, and have defaulted on $80,000 of debts. A long time ago, I used to think I was
conservative and ethical, but now I just feel like a bad person. I am so depressed. I am not even sure if I can fix my mistakes.

Do you ever feel guilty about things you have done? What skeletons do you have in your closet? Any advice?

*takes a swig of booze, then belches fire as he listens to weblinks opine from atop the Planet Express building*
Weblinks: "I have nothing to live for. I'm going to jump!"
Bystanders: "No! Think of your family! You have so much to live for!"
*lull in bystander chorus*
Me: "Do a flip!"
*steals wallet from adjacent bystander*
Reply
#15

Morals

How ethical are you? Would you lie? Would you jaywalk? Would you trespass
on private land? Would you cheat on your taxes? Would you steal candy from 7-11 if you thought you could get away from it? Would you have sex with your best friend's wife if she was hot? Would you beat an old man?

I guess I am really torn up about morals. I seem lost because even Tiger Woods and the Catholic church has made mistakes. I am so frozen about breaking rules that I can't do anything. I can't leave my girlfriend because I love her, but I live on her if if I stay. If I take job in Thailand, I will be working illegally on a tourist visa. I can't even cook a meal because I am afraid I won't follow the recipe exactly. I am stuck.
Reply
#16

Morals

Weblinks,
The past is the past and nobody can change that. However, we can all learn from our mistakes. Use your mistakes as your best lessons/teacher in the game of life and see how/what you'd do differently. Remember, experience is the result of failures. So now, you now what doesn't work, use that to do things differently and this time around, things will work out. I know, it's easier said than done, specially from someone who isn't in your shoes. I feel you bro, it is very tough. I personally went through a very difficult time myself not long time ago. Always be positive and optimistic, no matter what. Everything can be changed, to a extent.

Doesn't matter how many mistakes or bad stuff you may have done in your past, you can decide that from now on, you'll be a different person, a good person. The most classical example I can give you is read the all time classic book by Victor Hugo, Les Misérables, where a truly miserable lower than low life Jean Valjean completely changed to becoming a true inspiration to those around him. I won't reveal the plot of the book, but read it man, it'll help you see the light and that good is always the best route. As cheesy as it may sound, that book helped me when I was feeling down to have hope again in mankind and more importantly, in myself that I can be an inspiration to those around me. Another thing that helped me tremendously in those very difficult times was getting closer to God. Before that, I believed in God, but I wasn't religious at all. After reading the religous books, it totally changed me for the better. I'm not advocating to become religious in here, but those eternal books of the Bible, the Coran or the Tora (depending on your religion) can truly be a tremendous source of personal strength and giving you the direction and guidance to get through the difficult situation you're going through. I know it did for me and I'm sure it'll help you as well.

Hope this helps and all the best man.
Reply
#17

Morals

Also, as others have mentioned, maybe the fact that you got terminated from the marine was a blessing in disguise. Perhaps if you were still there, you would have been sent to a place where the worst could have happened and you would have been seriously injured or even paralysed and then what? Or even worst, could have been killed? Have you thought about it this way? You know, everything happens for a reason. Maybe the reason you were fired from the marine was a lifesaver for you. No matter how bad your situation may be or look, never forget that there are millions of people in the world who would LOVE to have your problems. One of the greatest things about travelling around the world is you see how the world lives and along the way, you see and meet people who are truly infinitely worst than us and that makes me always be grateful for whatever I have, no matter how little it may be. Everyday, I thank God that I'm alive, that I am in good health and that I have a roof over my head and food in my stomach and fridge and that I have a couple of bucks in my pocket/bank. Everything else is secondary. I thank God that I'm far from war zones and areas devasted by natural disasters. I thank God everyday that I have all these opportunities in front of me. Never ever take for granted these basic things man. So always be grateful for what you have and be positive, belief in yourself and all that self help crap. It may be crap, but you know what? It WORKS! As the saying goes, better be a cheesy happy person than a cool loser, if you know what I mean.

You've received some great advice in this board, now it's up to you, to take a serious look at things and see what would be the best thing to do for you and your life. And that is something that none of us in here can help you with. Only you can. Not easy but doable if you're building on a strong foundation, which can be either good true friends, family and or religion/spirituality.

All the best man.
Reply
#18

Morals

Wow, I appreciate your encouraging words. I'll have to check out that book. Thanks!
Reply
#19

Morals

Morals are totally dependant on how you frame your own life. I rarely feel bad about things i have done because they are things that were important to me, even if they dont agree with society. I feel guilt is an emotion reservered for the massive fuck ups in life, not the small things. I find that dwelling on the past and feeling remorse is counterproductive, as you cant change the past, only the future. It is important to learn from your mistakes, but chewing them every day will only sap your motivation.

Now i know you have strong anti chinese sentiment, but take a page from their book. Chinese dont feel bad about screwing other people, or doing terrible shit. Why? Because it is me and my own vs the world. You do what is best for your own intersts, and everyone else does as well. Why should you feel bad about getting what you want? Thats about the moral side.

On the other side, im assuming you live in the US. Criminal offences have nothing to do with morals. There are rules, and there are morals. Morals are what you believe, rules are what you must follow. Sounds like you broke a few rules. Might be hard to come back from that. I would recommend going overseas, but if you have a conviction on your record for violent crime, it would be very hard to even start over in the places ive been.

But then again, every day is a new chance to do something for yourself. Mistakes are there for learning from. You arent stupid for making a mistake once, you are for repeating it.

And seriously man. You feel bad about smoking pot a few times? just WOW! ^^
Reply
#20

Morals

I realize that I shouldn't waste time thinking about the past and people need to look out for themselves, but I want to think that I have higher morals and that I am better than others. For example, I look down on illegal immigrants who work in the US, get mad at employers who don't pay me, dislike idiots who
smoke in non-smoking areas, complain about people who play loud music, call the police
on kids who open fire hydrants, hate cheats and whores, don't respect sluts, criticize junkies and bums, hate thieves and killers, detest criminals and deadbeats, am annoyed at vandals, and get upset at jerks who spit or litter. One reason I am so hard on myself is because if I do bad things myself and criticize others, I am a hyprocrite. Someone who cheats on his girlfriend can't really criticize a homeless guy living on welfare. Who is more moral?

I am really torn up by this. I want everybody to do good, but too many people do bad. I can't feel superior, hold my head high, be proud of myself, and look down on others. I was raised better. I have a conscience. I want to think that I have high ethics and standards. I want to be like a saint. I know whining about my mistakes doesn't do any good, but I think you could see
why I feel so bad about this.
Reply
#21

Morals

Quote: (05-01-2010 10:59 PM)weblinks Wrote:  

I realize that I shouldn't waste time thinking about the past and people need to look out for themselves, but I want to think that I have higher morals and that I am better than others. For example, I look down on illegal immigrants who work in the US, get mad at employers who don't pay me, dislike idiots who
smoke in non-smoking areas, complain about people who play loud music, call the police
on kids who open fire hydrants, hate cheats and whores, don't respect sluts, criticize junkies and bums, hate thieves and killers, detest criminals and deadbeats, am annoyed at vandals, and get upset at jerks who spit or litter. One reason I am so hard on myself is because if I do bad things myself and criticize others, I am a hyprocrite. Someone who cheats on his girlfriend can't really criticize a homeless guy living on welfare. Who is more moral?

I am really torn up by this. I want everybody to do good, but too many people do bad. I can't feel superior, hold my head high, be proud of myself, and look down on others. I was raised better. I have a conscience. I want to think that I have high ethics and standards. I want to be like a saint. I know whining about my mistakes doesn't do any good, but I think you could see
why I feel so bad about this.

You have a huge misconception. In the real world, there are no high morals. People will do and rationalize anything they want to. Double think is a reality. Some people, mostly those who feel they lack value use higher morals to give themselves value in much the same way guys who are scared to talk to women make excuses as to why they don't approach. People look at other people and say they are immoral, in most cases, is due to envy. Im pretty sure everyone who defamed Clinton for his incident was secretly wishing they were able to have the same kind of experience.

The fundamental problem is imo is the lack of personal worth. I dont know all the situations, but i have never seen someone who truly believes that they have worth in at least a few major areas. Look at businessmen for example. Never will you meet a group of more "immoral" and "unethical" people, but they are happy with themselves because they excel in what they do. Morals all sound nice and good on paper, but in fact, those with high value know that they are not stuck to these on, and dont antagonize over their social "short comings."

The way you were raised does have a an impact on yourself, but it is by no means the definition of self. I was raised strictly Jehovah's Witness, yet their moral beliefs have little impact on my life. I lie on a regular basis for business about everything, from my age to my nationality, but yet i still hold honesty as a very important virtue.

Im thinking as what it comes down to is a lack of personal success that has you questioning morals. Sounds like you have had a hard life, and not all of it is your fault. But you admit it is a personal decision to want to be "better morally" then everyone else. If that is really your goal, you shouldn't feel torn up about it. Everyone looks out for them self. If you need a reason to look down on someone, make it. Get a skill such as playing a musical instrument, learn a new language, or even become a great computer gamer. Morals are an inherently flawed system of rating, as no one follows them unless they are afraid of getting caught. And as with any system that bases itself on society is something painful to try to follow. Ya it would be all great if no one steals, but why do the rich get off so much easier then the poor? It just doesnt work.
Reply
#22

Morals

Interesting.

Maybe everyone thinks they are moral, but I think most people would agree
that some people have more ethics than others. I am sure the great majority of people would say Jimmy Carter has higher morals than Ted Bundy did, for example.

I appreciate the advice. I am not sure if being highly talented in a skill would outweigh an ethical flaw, though. Someone who speaks French and Japanese fluently could be proud and feel superior to others, but he would still be a bad person if he also robs banks.

Maybe I should crawl on my hands and knees for 10 years, volunteer in a homeless shelter, or become a priest to make up for my mistakes. I can't believe how stupid I have been been. If there is any good that can come out of my post, I hope everyone will be aware that mistakes you make will come back and bite you. Trust me, you can't escape guilt and regret.
Reply
#23

Morals

Quote: (05-01-2010 10:59 PM)weblinks Wrote:  

I realize that I shouldn't waste time thinking about the past and people need to look out for themselves, but I want to think that I have higher morals and that I am better than others. For example, I look down on illegal immigrants who work in the US, get mad at employers who don't pay me, dislike idiots who
smoke in non-smoking areas, complain about people who play loud music, call the police
on kids who open fire hydrants, hate cheats and whores, don't respect sluts, criticize junkies and bums, hate thieves and killers, detest criminals and deadbeats, am annoyed at vandals, and get upset at jerks who spit or litter. One reason I am so hard on myself is because if I do bad things myself and criticize others, I am a hyprocrite. Someone who cheats on his girlfriend can't really criticize a homeless guy living on welfare. Who is more moral?

I am really torn up by this. I want everybody to do good, but too many people do bad. I can't feel superior, hold my head high, be proud of myself, and look down on others. I was raised better. I have a conscience. I want to think that I have high ethics and standards. I want to be like a saint. I know whining about my mistakes doesn't do any good, but I think you could see
why I feel so bad about this.

and

Quote: (05-03-2010 09:40 AM)weblinks Wrote:  

Interesting.

Maybe everyone thinks they're are moral, but I think most people would agree
that some people have more ethics than others. I am sure the great majority of people would say Jimmy Carter has higher morals than Ted Bundy did, for example.

I appreciate the advice. I am not sure if being highly talented in a skill would outweigh an ethical flaw, though. Someone who speaks French and Japanese fluently could be proud and feel superior to others, but he would still be a bad person if he also robs banks.

Maybe I should crawl on my hands and knees for 10 years, volunteer in a homeless shelter, or become a priest to make up for my mistakes. I can't believe how stupid I have been been. If there is any good that can come out of my post, I hope everyone will be aware that mistakes you make will come back and bite you. Trust me, you can't escape guilt and regret.

Weblinks,

I mean this comment with no disrespect, and only a desire to help you come to grips with your internal struggle:

Whoever put these fundamentally flawed ideas of morality, superiority, judgment and self worth in your head has done you a huge disservice and have given you a 'broken' mental operating system which is causing you internal conflict because it is deeply flawed or otherwise misconstrued at its root. It sounds like you were raised in a religious household, but perhaps not. In any case, you are affected by, in my opinion, the very flawed morality taught in conservative Christian communities. Could be fundamentalist / Evangelist style Christianity or catholicism.

This isn't you fault; or even you parents fault, as I'm sure they taught you the same things that they were taught. I blame the very selfish motives of society, in general.

The USA (assuming where you are from) culture in-particular gives us very conflicting system of morality. We are taught to be good to each other, and that we are a country of morally superior people, but we are more subtly taught that we are worth as much as the money that we make. Therefore, we many time violate the first rule to meet the expectations of the second.

The twisted forms of Christian religion taught these days try to resolve these issues, with a result that breeds individuals who feel superior, judgmental, and at the same time will stab their brother in the back for some extra cash. I know, because its happened to me. I respect someone who robs me and is honest about it much more than someone who claims to be morally superior, but persecutes people who are different from them, who doesn't really care about others (because poor people don't have enough value) and who will talk out of one side of their mouth while supporting political policy that is entirely counter to their religious claims.

I'm not saying that this is you, I'm just drawing a line between your internal conflict and the conflicting value systems taught in conservative america.

This is my recommendation to you, to help you find more happiness and peace in life, and to help you to meet anyones standards of being a good person:

1. Stop judging people.

If you don't do anything else that I recommend, this single non-action will change your life more than any other. Believe me. Stop fucking judging people. I can't emphasize this key to happiness enough.

Whether they be whores, junkies, kids playing in fire hydrants, deadbeats, or any one else. No one is perfect, and you have no idea what those people went through to be in that position. One day, it could be you, or me, out of necessity. Mayberry only exists on TV, and the world is not black and white. Almost everyone operates in some type of grey zone, and those who claim to be perfect on the outside are often some of the worst, even by their own belligerently advertised standards. They are just better at hiding it than others. Look at Ted Haggard. But there are a million other people that could be held up as examples

A very few people get dealt a lucky hand in life, and never have the necessity to behave amorally by societies outwardly advertised standards (which includes the 'amorality' of being poor). Society then holds these people up for everyone to idolize (they are almost always wealthy - which is no coincidence), but the so advertised normalcy of this situation is not normal at all. Its an illusion, and its designed to keep you in line and producing.

Embrace the whore, the junkie, the deadbeat. Find out about them. Ask about how they got there. Many will surprise you. How many homelss vietnam and Gulf vets do you think there are? Are these people amoral?

Anyway, judgment and the following superiority complex are responsible for a hell of a lot of suffering and conflict in the world. Stop adding to it. By definition, judging others is not moral, its amoral. Once you stop, you will feel much less conflict about yourself.

The ONLY exception allowed to the rule of non-judgment, is when people are infringing on the inalienable rights of others, usually for their own benefit. Again, that is the only time when your are allowed to pass judgement. Actions that fall under that category: Murder, theft, lying and a sociopathic level of manipulation. Its difficult for me to come up with anything else.

An example of something that I also don't agree with, but that doesn't fall under any of the above categories: Illegal immigration.
I don't blame the immigrants and you shouldn't either. They are doing what is necessary to survive. Blame the politicians who let them in the country, to the benefit of big business. Manipulating and lying to the american people, for their benefit.

2. Become a humanist.

Even if you have religion, research and practice what it means to be a humanist. Get some empathy. If you love your family, there is a fundamental moral conflict in not loving your neighbor, and by extension, everyone else. The only moral excuse for loving less is for there to be physically less people. Thats the truth. Otherwise, don;t worry about being moral because your 'morality' would be counter to every form of morality taught in almost every traditional religious sect in the world. If you can't 'do unto others as you would have done unto you', which includes the extension of love and empathy, then don't worry about anything because the issue of you being moral would be solved. You would not be. Give, give, give. Don't worry about receiving, because the world will disappoint you.

Then, as long as your doing your best, even if you wander into your previously thought of 'amoral' territory out of necessity, you will be a good person. If you really want to feel good about yourself, just DON'T INFRINGE ON THE RIGHTS OF OTHERS. Thats it. Everything else is just details, as far as morality is concerned.

3.

Read:

"Quantum Psychology" by Wilson

and

"The Way of Zen" by Watts

In order, to give you some insight into the reality of values / morality systems. Not easy reads, although not that hard either, but life changing as far as perception is concerned.
Reply
#24

Morals

Quote: (04-07-2010 02:37 PM)weblinks Wrote:  

Doesn't a rising tide float all boats?

I can't draw any conclusions from this simple metaphor, as it relates to the very complicated world of real life economics. I'll assume this is an allusion to trickle down economics. It has been well demonstrated that this doesn't work. Money sticks at the top, it doesn't trickle down.

Quote: (04-07-2010 02:37 PM)weblinks Wrote:  

Look at US growth compared to socialist European growth.

Entirely too simple of a correlation that does not take into consideration the myriad of factors that create or inhibit growth. Also, 'growth' is not defined, measured, shown, compared or otherwise analyzed. Besides all of that, isn't it really about quality of life, as far as your concerned? What do you care if the 'growth' statistics are affected by the billionaires of the country who have gotten richer, while your quality of life has either stagnated or declined? Seriously, Americans need to know what growth means, how it has historically affected their quality of life, and they need to know how to compare it to Europe if thats what they are comparing.

Quote: (04-07-2010 02:37 PM)weblinks Wrote:  

The USA believes in survival of the fittest and being responsible for yourself.

There are over 300 million people in this country. They are all free to, and largely believe in different things. That is one of the cornerstones of freedom in America. This statement is nothing more than propaganda that you've been programmed into believing it is your duty to believe. Propaganda forwarded by the very 'Big Government' that your afraid of.

Quote: (04-07-2010 02:37 PM)weblinks Wrote:  

I am afraid socialism might lead to Communism. I don't know of many people who would want to live in a Soviet Union or North Korea.

Because I've never lived under communism, I can't comment. But neither can you. You or I have no idea what living under communism is like, other than what you've been taught to believe by people with very clear agendas. For that matter, I've never lived under capitalism. Neither have you. They have never existed as pure systems. I would suggest talking to someone who has lived under Soviet Socialism, as well as American style capitalism/corporatism, and has the experience to compare, before you form your opinions. Otherwise, you have absolutely no basis for your opinion. North Korea is totalitarianism.


Quote: (04-07-2010 02:37 PM)weblinks Wrote:  

I think a government who governs the least, governs the best. Welfare makes people lazy and someone will need to pay the bills.
To incredibly broad generalizations and assertions that you can't back up. You've been taught both of these mantras. I agree that there are problems with both welfare and big government, but its not as simple and clear cut as your statements infer, Its much, much more complex than that. To believe in the absolutes that you statements lay forth, would leave you open to an incredible amount of manipulation by those with agendas that are not in your, or anyones, best interest.

Quote: (04-07-2010 02:37 PM)weblinks Wrote:  

I do worry about population growth, but low birth rates are more the result of wealth and not politics. Compare Japan to Mexico, for example.

I'm not sure what you mean. Politics affect the distribution of money and resources, which affect wealth, which affect population growth. Also, I'm not sure whether you mean that wealth causes population to increase or decrease. The largest population growth is currently occurring in the poorest of countries, as well as countries with the most people(USA), as positive population growth is an exponential function of current population. Also, the politics of America, in allowing illegal immigrants in, unnaturally causes the population of the USA to keep increasing.
Reply
#25

Morals

I have something to think about now. I have a lot of free time, don't have any friends, and don't go out much.

I totally agree that Americans feel that they are morally superior to others. I think Western thinking generally teaches us to behave morally. Despite feeling burdened by guilt myself, I think societies that raise children like this are good. This is one reason why I hated China. The Chinese drive on sidewalks, put antifreeze in toothpaste, and can't even wait in a line. Few people in China think of strangers. I prefer the fake politeness of Americans who may hate you, but smile while saying "Have a nice day!". Broadly speaking, Westerners often consider consequences and weigh whether or not their actions hurt others.

I will think about being less judgmental. I will take action if I see someone doing something illegal, though. I have caught several shoplifters, pickpockets, vandals, and drug-dealers before and I don't hestitate to tell someone about them. I think if no one respects rules, society breaks down. There are reasons for having laws. Basically, I am just saying being moral is better than being immoral.

Maybe I am crazy, stubborn, brain-washed, too patriotic, and don't think critically enough, but I think most people would agree that America is fantastically successful. I get the feeling that Americans tend to believe that eveyone would be living in caves if there was no USA. There must be something to this success besides just luck.

I am not arguing here, but I just think if there are rich people, they will buy things and start companies that will support poor people. I respect people like Ray Kroc, Thomas Edison, Andrew Carnegie, and Sam Walton more than losers like me. Billionaires aren't all born rich. I also think welfare does make most people lazy. I have seen it with my own eyes. Why would most people work if the government gave them free food, free medical care, a free house, and a monthly check?

As far as Communism goes, I think democracy and capitalism (despite being imperfect) is obviously the better system. Which system has lasted longer? Who doesn't want freedom?

http://socyberty.com/politics/why-commun...-not-work/
Reply


Forum Jump:


Users browsing this thread: 1 Guest(s)