[speakeasy]

This woman is getting thrashed on facebook for writing this. Just for telling the truth. It's a breath of fresh air to hear a women defending femininity. At the same time it's depressing because you know this is such a minority view and how many women will hate her for it. If this article was written in Russia or Colombia women would be like, "well...duh."

http://www.lifetimemoms.com/buzz/the-cas...1162012_12

Quote:

I’m just going to say the thing that everybody thought but nobody wanted to say. And I’m saying it because I live in the real world of male/female relationships. When your cable or local news network inevitably showed the split screen of General Director David Patraeus’ wife, Holly, and his mistress, Paula Broadwell, you most definitely thought, "Holy hotcakes! Will someone please get Holly some conditioner… And a brush, for crying out loud". Your inside voice, may have even said,”Well, that explains a lot.”

Don’t feel bad. Looks matter! This is the reality of the world we live in. I don’t make the rules, people, but I do try to play the game. And while as women, we don’t have to subscribe to razor thin bodies and other unrealistic images of beauty, as a general rule I think it is good to have your hair combed and tidy in public as much as possible. I mean I think your mother taught you that circa age 5. Caveat: this expectation does not apply to mothers of newborns who have a 6-8 week pass (at least) for showering, grooming and being even remotely presentable.

Back to my point.

Here’s the thing ladies, men are visual. You’ve read the books. You’ve seen the casualties. They like to see their woman looking good - whatever YOUR good is. But here’s the most important part so pay attention - you should also have some desire to be presentable for YOU. Forget your man - doesn’t looking and feeling good about yourself matter to you?? And by you I mean you, Mrs. Patreaus...

[Handsome Creepy Eel]

Notice how much hate she is already eating for stating this simple (if unpleasant) truth.

[speakeasy]

(11-18-2012 05:43 AM)Handsome Creepy Eel Wrote:  

Notice how much hate she is already eating for stating this simple (if unpleasant) truth.

I just read some of those comments below. Some of them are saying Patreaus is no Brad Pitt himself. I think he's a pretty decent looking guy for 60. Could pass for late 40s.



Meanwhile his wife looks about as feminine as the Quaker Oats man.



A woman married to a high status man with options that lets herself go is a fool if she thinks he's never going to cheat. I'm not defending it per se, just stating the reality.

[Wool Suit]

(11-18-2012 06:10 AM)speakeasy Wrote:  

(11-18-2012 05:43 AM)Handsome Creepy Eel Wrote:  

Notice how much hate she is already eating for stating this simple (if unpleasant) truth.

I just read some of those comments below. Some of them are saying Patreaus is no Brad Pitt himself. I think he's a pretty decent looking guy for 60. Could pass for late 40s.



Meanwhile his wife looks about as feminine as the Quaker Oats man.



A woman married to a high status man with options that lets herself go is a fool if she thinks he's never going to cheat. I'm not defending it per se, just stating the reality.

Petraeus is the Brad Pitt of the intelligence community. He's a rockstar tactician and a brilliant strategist. Although his wars were incredibly unpopular, his techniques at combatting insurgency, particularly covert urbanized insurgency were revolutionary. He basically turned around a complete shitshow in Iraq in the late phase, although it is unpopular to mention that. The man is grade A American leader, cut from the same cloth as George Washington and Dwight D. Eisenhower. The man has been shot in the chest with an M-16 and done 50 pushups after surgery to prove he was combat worthy .

I've held back on these threads because I've actually met the man on two occasions, once when he was Major General and once when he was DCIA. He was an absolute gentleman, scholarly and genial. This fucking sham job to his honor is a national disgrace. Every politician fucks someone other than his wife; Petraeus is the only one I know who stepped down before an absolute shitstorm enveloped the Hill and CIA. We've burned one of our best leaders, someone generally outside the political beltway, over an affair? This isn't John Edwards - this man is the preeminent expert on counterinsurgency. So he got his dick wet in a younger, hotter woman. So do a lot of men. A big fuck you to the people throwing him under the bus for Benghazi and his biographer.

Basically if you're a government wonk chick, meeting him will give you unparalleled gina tingles. It's like meeting God. Or at least Mike Tyson for a boxing fan.

General/Director David Petraeus is beyond reproach in my book. That our society would willfully toss away such an amazing resource over a biological certainty (hypergamy, extant polygyny) shows just how fucked this PC culture has made us. American leaders like Petraeus don't come along every day; for every one of him there are tens of bumbling, cutthroat, weasely beltway insiders that haven't seen a battlefield in their life yet sit and throw stones at a man they could only ever hope to measure up to.

Fuckers.

[Btbob]

(11-18-2012 09:00 AM)Wool Suit Wrote:  

(11-18-2012 06:10 AM)speakeasy Wrote:  

(11-18-2012 05:43 AM)Handsome Creepy Eel Wrote:  

Notice how much hate she is already eating for stating this simple (if unpleasant) truth.

I just read some of those comments below. Some of them are saying Patreaus is no Brad Pitt himself. I think he's a pretty decent looking guy for 60. Could pass for late 40s.



Meanwhile his wife looks about as feminine as the Quaker Oats man.



A woman married to a high status man with options that lets herself go is a fool if she thinks he's never going to cheat. I'm not defending it per se, just stating the reality.

Petraeus is the Brad Pitt of the intelligence community. He's a rockstar tactician and a brilliant strategist. Although his wars were incredibly unpopular, his techniques at combatting insurgency, particularly covert urbanized insurgency were revolutionary. He basically turned around a complete shitshow in Iraq in the late phase, although it is unpopular to mention that. The man is grade A American leader, cut from the same cloth as George Washington and Dwight D. Eisenhower. The man has been shot in the chest with an M-16 and done 50 pushups after surgery to prove he was combat worthy .

I've held back on these threads because I've actually met the man on two occasions, once when he was Major General and once when he was DCIA. He was an absolute gentleman, scholarly and genial. This fucking sham job to his honor is a national disgrace. Every politician fucks someone other than his wife; Petraeus is the only one I know who stepped down before an absolute shitstorm enveloped the Hill and CIA. We've burned one of our best leaders, someone generally outside the political beltway, over an affair? This isn't John Edwards - this man is the preeminent expert on counterinsurgency. So he got his dick wet in a younger, hotter woman. So do a lot of men. A big fuck you to the people throwing him under the bus for Benghazi and his biographer.

Basically if you're a government wonk chick, meeting him will give you unparalleled gina tingles. It's like meeting God. Or at least Mike Tyson for a boxing fan.

General/Director David Petraeus is beyond reproach in my book. That our society would willfully toss away such an amazing resource over a biological certainty (hypergamy, extant polygyny) shows just how fucked this PC culture has made us. American leaders like Petraeus don't come along every day; for every one of him there are tens of bumbling, cutthroat, weasely beltway insiders that haven't seen a battlefield in their life yet sit and throw stones at a man they could only ever hope to measure up to.

Fuckers.

Jesus, that was well said.

[Timoteo]

(11-18-2012 09:18 AM)Btbob Wrote:  

(11-18-2012 09:00 AM)Wool Suit Wrote:  

(11-18-2012 06:10 AM)speakeasy Wrote:  

(11-18-2012 05:43 AM)Handsome Creepy Eel Wrote:  

Notice how much hate she is already eating for stating this simple (if unpleasant) truth.

I just read some of those comments below. Some of them are saying Patreaus is no Brad Pitt himself. I think he's a pretty decent looking guy for 60. Could pass for late 40s.



Meanwhile his wife looks about as feminine as the Quaker Oats man.



A woman married to a high status man with options that lets herself go is a fool if she thinks he's never going to cheat. I'm not defending it per se, just stating the reality.

Petraeus is the Brad Pitt of the intelligence community. He's a rockstar tactician and a brilliant strategist. Although his wars were incredibly unpopular, his techniques at combatting insurgency, particularly covert urbanized insurgency were revolutionary. He basically turned around a complete shitshow in Iraq in the late phase, although it is unpopular to mention that. The man is grade A American leader, cut from the same cloth as George Washington and Dwight D. Eisenhower. The man has been shot in the chest with an M-16 and done 50 pushups after surgery to prove he was combat worthy .

I've held back on these threads because I've actually met the man on two occasions, once when he was Major General and once when he was DCIA. He was an absolute gentleman, scholarly and genial. This fucking sham job to his honor is a national disgrace. Every politician fucks someone other than his wife; Petraeus is the only one I know who stepped down before an absolute shitstorm enveloped the Hill and CIA. We've burned one of our best leaders, someone generally outside the political beltway, over an affair? This isn't John Edwards - this man is the preeminent expert on counterinsurgency. So he got his dick wet in a younger, hotter woman. So do a lot of men. A big fuck you to the people throwing him under the bus for Benghazi and his biographer.

Basically if you're a government wonk chick, meeting him will give you unparalleled gina tingles. It's like meeting God. Or at least Mike Tyson for a boxing fan.

General/Director David Petraeus is beyond reproach in my book. That our society would willfully toss away such an amazing resource over a biological certainty (hypergamy, extant polygyny) shows just how fucked this PC culture has made us. American leaders like Petraeus don't come along every day; for every one of him there are tens of bumbling, cutthroat, weasely beltway insiders that haven't seen a battlefield in their life yet sit and throw stones at a man they could only ever hope to measure up to.

Fuckers.

Jesus, that was well said.

He isn't lost as a resource for his expertise. When similar situations arise around the world, they'll be consulting with him, and the playbook he already wrote will be referred to. While I understand your overall point, you aren't acknowledging that the standard for him in HIS position is far different from that of the average politician. If it were solely about pseudo-morality bullshit, I'd agree with you 100%, but their own don't stand behind them either (it isn't just the press and public that force them out). The ambition of colleagues that want their positions also leads to them being removed. You also have to acknowledge that he unwittingly gave the wrong person access to possibly sensitive materials and communications. They've already found that Broadwell was in possession of classified documents, documents that she may have had access to read, but not actually remove. Suppose she saw something highly sensitive and tried to steal that material also? It's hard to keep a man in the position of CIA director if it appears that he can't keep his own house in order.

[Timoteo]

"...And that your husband/partner/boyfriend actually partnered with that woman! And most likely because of something he was physcially attracted to. Yes, the personality mattered later, blah blah blah, but he had to notice YOU first."

Overall, her piece is on point. This quote in particular is one that women can't seem to acknowledge. Granted, they all think they're great people, and are all beautiful inside and out. But we aren't attracted to that first - we covet what we SEE. When you're posted up across the room and scanning the crowd looking for someone worth stepping to, it's looks we're scanning for. We don't know anything about you at that point other than what you look like. Until we start talking to you and spending time with you, we don't know what's under the surface. After we interact with you we may decide quickly that ALL you have to offer is your looks, and will proceed accordingly.

Honestly, some hair-care products, and new hairstyle and make-up won't matter in the case of Mrs. Petraeus - she's busted. It's putting lipstick on a pig. She just isn't an attractive women, and probably wasn't particularly attractive when she was much younger. But there are plenty of women that would be much more attractive if they put in some maintenance work. Also, the mantra that "real men don't cheat" is bullshit. A real man DOES cheat when his bitch is slippin' for whatever reason. A weak man suffers in silence and allows a bitch to make him miserable, refusing to act and finding happiness elsewhere.

[Basil Ransom]

I have more to say on this, but for now...

Quote:

Honestly, some hair-care products, and new hairstyle and make-up won't matter in the case of Mrs. Petraeus - she's busted. It's putting lipstick on a pig. She just isn't an attractive women, and probably wasn't particularly attractive when she was much younger.

I think this is wrong, but I don't blame you. Ugly women always look as if they've always been that way. Some older images of Holly:




And plenty of women look dramatically different even in the face, after weight loss, eg



Not always, but it can be hard to predict what they'll look like. What often looks like an inescapably ugly face is actually just fat. Holly would definitely improve with serious weight loss, better clothes, some hair treatment and makeup. How much? I don't know.

Haha, the author of the article linked is quite the piece of work:

Quote:

I also need to note that men cheat on beautiful women all the time. And for every man that may have cheated on me or broke up with me, NEVER did he say it was because I let myself go. I refuse to give a man, such an out. Sorry Mr. Loser, you will have to find another excuse.

Even the author is still delusional. She doesn't finger the biggest factor in Holly's decline: obesity.

The author makes a point I suspected was typical of American women.

Quote:

But here’s the most important part so pay attention - you should also have some desire to be presentable for YOU. Forget your man - doesn’t looking and feeling good about yourself matter to you?? And by you I mean you, Mrs. Patreaus.

Even the women here who DO try and look good after getting hitched, they do it for themselves, to make themselves feel good. Tell them that they should do it as a reason to keep their husband happy, and even some of these women will go apeshit on you. The mere idea that they have to do anything more than show up is absolutely diabolical. Thus responses like this: http://www.rooshvforum.network/thread-14109.html

[kdolo]

(11-18-2012 11:47 AM)basilransom Wrote:  

I have more to say on this, but for now...

Quote:

Honestly, some hair-care products, and new hairstyle and make-up won't matter in the case of Mrs. Petraeus - she's busted. It's putting lipstick on a pig. She just isn't an attractive women, and probably wasn't particularly attractive when she was much younger.

I think this is wrong, but I don't blame you. Ugly women always look as if they've always been that way. Some older images of Holly:




And plenty of women look dramatically different even in the face, after weight loss, eg



Not always, but it can be hard to predict what they'll look like. What often looks like an inescapably ugly face is actually just fat. Holly would definitely improve with serious weight loss, better clothes, some hair treatment and makeup. How much? I don't know.

That woman is still busted in the face .....even after the weight loss

[kdolo]

I get the article writer's point. But she's a little off base here.

The reality is that a 60 year old woman - well past her reproducutive years is not supposed to be sexy ....... it simply doesnt work that way.

There is nothing or next to nothing that she could have done to maintain her husband's sexual interest.....Men and women are different - men can look good in a sexual way for a long time if they stay fit and can impregnate women forever. Biology is Destiny.

this is a point the feminists miss or refuse to acknowledge.

It is clear that Mrs. Petreaus checked out a long long time ago. She is no longer a sexual being - many women do this in their post menopausal years. Those two haven't had sex in years - and they probably had an "understanding".......

he fucks discreetly and she pretends that she doesnt know. Many couples I know are like this...

The only problem here is the mistress who went batshit crazy (indiscreet) and Petreaus allowing the mistress to much access to his vital resources - his work.

[Handsome Creepy Eel]

I agree with what Wool Suit wrote, yet I can't wrap my mind about this: why was Petraeus using a Gmail account? Or is this just a rumor?

[speakeasy]

(11-18-2012 11:47 AM)basilransom Wrote:  

Even the women here who DO try and look good after getting hitched, they do it for themselves, to make themselves feel good. Tell them that they should do it as a reason to keep their husband happy, and even some of these women will go apeshit on you. The mere idea that they have to do anything more than show up is absolutely diabolical. Thus responses like this: http://www.rooshvforum.network/thread-14109.html

I understand your point and it would be great if women had a deep desire to look great to be attractive to men. The problem with this though is if they are only putting in the effort to please someone else, they will eventually grow comfortable in a relationship and start to slack off when they feel less fear of being judged.

I think it's a good thing if a woman is somewhat vain with regards to her own appearance. With the primary purpose of meeting her own expectations when she looks in the mirror. That's the type of woman that will not slack off after getting hitched. In the end though, whether she's doing it for herself or her man is inconsequential so long as she's actually doing it.

[Way Cool Jr]

I think that his wife knew or probably suspected about him cheating and kinda accepted it, before the scandal came out in the media.
She's a 60 years old woman but that doesn't mean that she have to look like that, other women like Hillary Clinton or Romney's wife are around the same age, sure they are not sexy but at least they are presentable and look ok for their age.
Even my mom commented, after seeing a picture of Holly, that: "She looks like his mom, not even like his wife". This says all.

[Timoteo]

(11-18-2012 11:47 AM)basilransom Wrote:  

I have more to say on this, but for now...

Quote:

Honestly, some hair-care products, and new hairstyle and make-up won't matter in the case of Mrs. Petraeus - she's busted. It's putting lipstick on a pig. She just isn't an attractive women, and probably wasn't particularly attractive when she was much younger.

I think this is wrong, but I don't blame you. Ugly women always look as if they've always been that way. Some older images of Holly:




And plenty of women look dramatically different even in the face, after weight loss, eg



Not always, but it can be hard to predict what they'll look like. What often looks like an inescapably ugly face is actually just fat. Holly would definitely improve with serious weight loss, better clothes, some hair treatment and makeup. How much? I don't know.

Haha, the author of the article linked is quite the piece of work:

Quote:

I also need to note that men cheat on beautiful women all the time. And for every man that may have cheated on me or broke up with me, NEVER did he say it was because I let myself go. I refuse to give a man, such an out. Sorry Mr. Loser, you will have to find another excuse.

Even the author is still delusional. She doesn't finger the biggest factor in Holly's decline: obesity.

The author makes a point I suspected was typical of American women.

Quote:

But here’s the most important part so pay attention - you should also have some desire to be presentable for YOU. Forget your man - doesn’t looking and feeling good about yourself matter to you?? And by you I mean you, Mrs. Patreaus.

Even the women here who DO try and look good after getting hitched, they do it for themselves, to make themselves feel good. Tell them that they should do it as a reason to keep their husband happy, and even some of these women will go apeshit on you. The mere idea that they have to do anything more than show up is absolutely diabolical. Thus responses like this: http://www.rooshvforum.network/thread-14109.html

I can look at a woman and have a good idea if she was hot when she was younger. I was only judging Mrs. Petraeus' face, and I could plainly see that she simply isn't pretty, and never was. The weight gain obviously didn't help. We all do this with fat chicks too - we look at the face and see what she could be if she got her weight under control.

I think if we posted a young Holly Petraeus' pics and did the "would you bang" thing, you'd get a lot of guys talking about man jaw, and guys railing about her teeth. Yes, her body was tight, but I think you'd get a lot of "5/10, would not bangs."

[Timoteo]

Here's a poll MSN is running on their home page:

Do you think infidelity should cost people their jobs?

19% Yes, it's indicative of character (47,944 votes)

29% No, it's a personal matter (72,282 votes)

45% Only if it affects the work environment (114,915 votes)

7% It's none of my business (17,809 votes)

As of 6:30pm EST, these are the numbers. This is pretty much how I feel about it.

[Basil Ransom]

(11-18-2012 01:24 PM)speakeasy Wrote:  

(11-18-2012 11:47 AM)basilransom Wrote:  

Even the women here who DO try and look good after getting hitched, they do it for themselves, to make themselves feel good. Tell them that they should do it as a reason to keep their husband happy, and even some of these women will go apeshit on you. The mere idea that they have to do anything more than show up is absolutely diabolical. Thus responses like this: http://www.rooshvforum.network/thread-14109.html

The problem with this though is if they are only putting in the effort to please someone else, they will eventually grow comfortable in a relationship and start to slack off when they feel less fear of being judged.

That depends on why the woman is trying to please her man. If she is doing it for its own sake, and enjoys satisfying him, and he expresses disapproval when she isn't up to par, then she has no reason to stop.

It all sounds so abstract, but it's a lot more common among non-Anglophone women. A Czech woman I once tried macking in America turned out to be married, and she told me, "my husband is the most beautiful man in the world to me, and I like doing nice things for him. When I tell my American friends this, they get angry and ask me if I'm his slave or something. So I don't have many American friends." Paraphrasing, but that was the spirit of her comments.

I have something of a girlfriend at the moment (according to her, not to me, ), who's not American and she sees it as her role to feed and fuck me. The American female strategy of neglecting a man is ridiculous to her. She's also fiercely independent and fucking crazy, lol.

That said, I've never been in a long-term relationship, so I haven't experienced how things might change over time.