[OGNorCal707]

Here's an article that kind of annoyed me from the SF Chronicle online, it's obviously written from a feminist perspective, and is pretty much based on a load of B.S.

http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cg...331D54.DTL

At first I thought it was written by a woman, then I looked and saw it was written by a man-(gina). I hate it when feminists and manginas try to make up non-existent issues out of nothing and try to blame it all on men.

Basically, it's men and by proxy our influence over society and culture, that keeps women from entering and succeeding in the computer engineering field.

Ofcourse the obvious, is that men are inherently better at certain things, as are women in others. I don't think it's any coincidence that pretty much all technology throughout history has be created and invented by man. Telling that to a feminist, would ofcourse bring up the reaction that women, never had the rights to create anything because they've been oppressed by man since the dawn of time.

The comments from the article are pretty money, basically half the commenters are guys who know what's up and call B.S., the other half are feminists and manginas who spout their typical women are oppressed B.S.

I never really paid much attention to all this "feminists" and male/female dynamics before I took the "red pill", but now I see things through a completely different lense.

[Cincinnatus]

What a crock of shit.

On a related note, I withdrew all support for one local university last year, because they eliminated their Computer Science program, but kept Women's Studies as a major.

The Spearhead ran a story about it:

University Kills Computer Science Major But Keeps Womens Studies

[Basil Ransom]

It's not about their lack of success per se, but that women don't even enter the field.

Besides the fact that computer science involves more masculine faculties, women shy away from computer science because it has low social status. Who does it? Extremely nerdy white guys, lame Asian guys, a few Asian girls, Indian Race Trolls, and dumpy Indian girls. Even when they make good money, they rarely get into executive positions. When they run the company, you still have Hollywood making fun of you for being a nerd. By comparison, doctors, lawyers and businessman/MBAs get much more respect.

I think there is some truth to it being an inhospitable environment, but it's not strictly a matter of sex. Programming courses tend to be populated by people who have been doing it as a hobby for several years. They also tend to be nerdy and lack sex/status appeal. Plus the hobbyists may have elitist/xenophobic mentalities, and it's compounded by the fact that this is the only place where they can really shine - everywhere else in society they're marginalized. "OMG you don't understand this? You suck." In programming, people tend to be very aware of the pecking order of good programmers, and I can see novices and girls especially being scared off by that. I imagine there are a fair number of people, guys or girls, who would make good programmers but are otherwise turned off by these factors, or never even consider it.

[porscheguy]

Look at what a wonderful job Carly Fiorina did at HP.

Why do some people need an engraved invitation to take up a career? Because once the red carpets are rolled out, the standards get lowered. That's why.

[Hades]

Yeah, coding is the realm of the social misfits, single-minded hobbyists, dudes/chicks with autism, and geniuses. We don't need morons and feminists working on code.

[Parlay44]

I work in Engineering. All I can say is that female Engineers aren't willing to commit to the lifestyle of the position. It's one thing on their plate. Male Engineers are Engineers 24/7. We're expected to be up on the latest and greatest technology. Sure they can type code. But to truly be an Engineer is an art and you have to commit all your resources to it.

[kbell]

"Feminist blame men" is redundant. Women do really well in computer art however.

[kolovrat]

Besides the fact that computer science involves more masculine faculties, women shy away from computer science because it has low social status.

You haven't met any brogrammers.

[R Smoov]

So what does women studies do again in comparison to computer science?

Women don't need to be studied.

[kosko]

(06-03-2012 09:33 PM)porscheguy Wrote:  

Look at what a wonderful job Carly Fiorina did at HP.

Why do some people need an engraved invitation to take up a career? Because once the red carpets are rolled out, the standards get lowered. That's why.

And Barbara Stymiest leading the Boardroom at RIM. That shit is about to sink.

Women can't flat out calculate and analyze and persue risks like Men. A females reaction is guarded (too mild) or over blown (too hostile) to any mentally computed/decoded task. I was talking with my homies online about how broads can't win Auto races. Danica Patrick hasn't won shit and she is in a situation where she is equal to her male counterparts. My homie brought up a point that a male will pursue a somewhat risky take on the lead or push where a error could mean he spins out or fucks his shit up. Women won't take these risks or they simply can't see them emerge.

[mymeowcat]

(06-03-2012 08:38 PM)basilransom Wrote:  

It's not about their lack of success per se, but that women don't even enter the field.

Besides the fact that computer science involves more masculine faculties, women shy away from computer science because it has low social status. Who does it? Extremely nerdy white guys, lame Asian guys, a few Asian girls, Indian Race Trolls, and dumpy Indian girls. Even when they make good money, they rarely get into executive positions. When they run the company, you still have Hollywood making fun of you for being a nerd. By comparison, doctors, lawyers and businessman/MBAs get much more respect.

I think there is some truth to it being an inhospitable environment, but it's not strictly a matter of sex. Programming courses tend to be populated by people who have been doing it as a hobby for several years. They also tend to be nerdy and lack sex/status appeal. Plus the hobbyists may have elitist/xenophobic mentalities, and it's compounded by the fact that this is the only place where they can really shine - everywhere else in society they're marginalized. "OMG you don't understand this? You suck." In programming, people tend to be very aware of the pecking order of good programmers, and I can see novices and girls especially being scared off by that. I imagine there are a fair number of people, guys or girls, who would make good programmers but are otherwise turned off by these factors, or never even consider it.

I gotta admit (as an Asian Computer Programmer) that this is so true and spot on! I couldn't have said it better. I have tried many times to avoid this profession all together but it was the only job I kept getting offers for.

One tip if you are in this position is to learn how to "embellish" it make it sound cool. Another tip is to do this job as a "free-lance" consultant as this sounds better. It is easier to show value as a free lance consultant because you can describe your job as "own your own business".

[Blackhawk]

Meg Whitman went from losing the election for California Governor in Nov 2011 to being CEO of HP in 2012 and laying off 25,000.

Why is she CEO of a technology company? Good question, considering most of her experience is at Disney. Would a man with her joke of a resume be hired as CEO of HP? No. No he would not.

[Handsome Creepy Eel]

I've read about this yesterday in NYT. One of the lines that got me laughing was "You know, it just feels weird to be the only girl in the room?"

[Basil Ransom]

(06-03-2012 11:21 PM)Parlay44 Wrote:  

I work in Engineering. All I can say is that female Engineers aren't willing to commit to the lifestyle of the position. It's one thing on their plate. Male Engineers are Engineers 24/7. We're expected to be up on the latest and greatest technology. Sure they can type code. But to truly be an Engineer is an art and you have to commit all your resources to it.

Yeah, I've noticed the same. It's broader than engineering, but it's especially true in computer related fields, where the skills needed are constantly evolving. Even girls who are engineers or programmers don't get really into the craft on their own time, of their own volition. The person teaching himself for his own edification, not even for any career benefit, is much more likely to be male. All crafts and hobbies are basically male by default. Even the feminine ones, like knitting, I'd bet are more male at the highest most technical levels.

I've known some female engineers, and the white ones especially would look askance at studying it on their own time. Few to no guys would do that - some might not make that extra effort, but they wouldn't belittle it.

The exception to this is education credentials. For whatever reason, when you dangle education credentials in front of girls, they eat it up.

I'm hardly a programmer, but having a distaste for politically correct bullshit lets you understand reality real quick. Everyone, especially girls, is so tied up with polite little lies about how people work that they can't see how things actually work.

Oh Kosko, as for RIM, you gotta lay that disaster at the hands of the two male founders.

[Soma]

Does anyone here have global statistics for women in computer science/engineering? For the reasons mentioned earlier, especially negative cultural associations attached to the fields, this seems to me to be largely an Anglo and Western European phenomenon. Anecdotally, at least, I've noticed proportionately more women in computer related fields in certain parts of Eastern Europe and Asia as well as Israel, and notably almost none in South America. These days, the men holding women down argument deserves an eye-roll at most.

[Icarus]

Engineering and CS require hard work, focus, commitment, and being able to delay gratification for years and years. In the West, we now have lazy, flaky, entitled princesses with ADHD who demand instant gratification. Is anyone surprised to hear that Engineering / CS are unpopular in the West?

I know a few good Russian / Ukrainian female programmers, but they're nothing spectacular. For them programming is a means to an end, and the end is to earn a living so that they can have financial stability and are able to feed their children. Women in Engineering / CS do not have that obsession with creation, that burning passion to do something great that the best male engineers / programmers possess. Some say that since men are not able to give birth, they satisfy their urge to create through artistic and technical pursuits.

[void]

(06-04-2012 09:11 AM)Icarus Wrote:  

Women in Engineering / CS do not have that obsession with creation, that burning passion to do something great that the best male engineers / programmers possess. Some say that since men are not able to give birth, they satisfy their urge to create through artistic and technical pursuits.

this. redirecting sexual energy to create something. well everyone is driven by this energy in his life.

[Nonpareil]

So in America men are taking blame not only for women being kept down, being paid less, being harassed and being kept out of the boardroom, but now for sucking at stuff too?

I'm thinking of pulling some capital together and starting some sort of cult on an Island somewhere in the Pacific, anybody down? Bring 3 women.