[playa_with_a_passport]

Pink Elephant, reminds me of when George Bush visited Brazil for the first time and he asked the Brazilian president if Brazil had any Black people, only for Condoleza Rice to cut him off and tell him that Brazil had the largest Black population in the Western Hemisphere. Saying that US and Canada has more Blacks than Brazil is beyond retarded. Also, Latin American countries are notorious for surpressing the numbers of Black people in their countries in the censuses. Even Argentina has a sizeable number of Blacks who were brought there as slaves. en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Afro_Argentine?wasRedirected=true

[Excelsior]

That's the weird thing about brazil. You always hear about how tolerant and multi cultural the country is, but the status of black people there just confuses me.

Let's just talk about black people and what it means to be black hypothetically. If you use a stricter version of the american definition(perhaps excluding guys like Obama who had one or more predominantly caucasian parents), you're still left with the clear fact that Brazil has MANY more blacks than the US. You can make that definition as strict as you like, but this numerical advantage seems to remain true even if you limit it to more clearly visually black people(excluding really light skinned guys like Malcolm X, for example, and maybe using guys like the soccer star Maicon as an example of the visual cutoff). Ask yourself: where are these black people in Brazil?

You can find them acting sometimes. They do sing. There are plenty of them playing soccer(they seem to be a bit overepresented in this regard).
But you don't see any of them at high levels of government, business, education, etc, etc. The models are almost all towards the whiter end of the genetic spectrum. The money is concentrated amongst the lighter skinned in the country(favelas are filled with blacks). There aren't many at their elite schools(Ivy League schools, by comparison, are usually around 8% black at least).

There aren't(and haven't been, save for maybe one exception who I believe was a judge) any blacks at the president's side in government, and very few notable black politicians. Salvador da Bahia is over 80% black, and they have never had a black mayor. Think about this for a second, especially if you're American. Do you know of any major American city(population over 100,000) that has a majority black population but has not had a black mayor? All of the major cities with huge black populations in the US(Detroit, atlanta, Brimingham, etc) have hit this threshold LONG ago. And yet here is Salvador, a city of 3 million known worldwide for its Afro Brazillian cultural flavor, without a single black mayor. Not even one.

Think of the nation's largest companies and ask yourself how many Afro brazillians run them. I can name a few in the US where blacks are high up(American Express, Time Warner, etc). Can you do that in Brazil? I don't see many black executives at Telemar, Embraer or Petrobras.

Compare this to America. Here, we have had blacks in most of the major presidential cabinet positions. We have dozens of them in congress and we've had dozens more in the senate over time. There are at least half a dozen fortune 500 ceos I could name, more if I go include all who served within the last ten years and more still if I include other senior exectuives(COOs, Executive VPs, Managing Directors, etc). The black middle class in the US is much smaller than the white one here, but it is still highly visible. Its easy to tell its there, and that not every black person in this country lives in the ghetto.

Brazil just doesn't seem to have this at all. Sorry for the long rant, but that has always concerned me a bit. Its a perplexing(and kind of frustrating) phenomenon, especially examining it as a black person.

[speakeasy]

Good insights Athlone. The same is true in ALL of Latin America. Blacks and Amerindians are kept at the bottom while those that are white or can pass for white have inherited all the wealth and privilege. There ain't no Oprah in Latin America. They don't want to see a black woman on TV. Sadly, from what I've heard, even the blacks and browns don't want to see THEMSELVES on television. They prefer to see white actors. It's pretty much a lost cause down there. Black Latin activists can't mobilize people because nobody wants to be considered black. They'll call themselves something else. Mulatto or brown, or whatever. In the U.S., they didn't have that choice. A light skin black had to drink from the black fountain just like the dark ones. So it was easier to unify people to fight for their rights instead of the self-denial in Latin America. The One Drop Rule actually did us a big favor up here in that regards.

Btw, it's interesting that you'd refer to Malcolm X as "very light skinned", he looks kind of medium tone to me:



When I think of very light skinned I'm thinking of Sean Paul or the dude from Kid 'n Play:

[IshGibbor]

(08-15-2010 02:44 AM)speakeasy Wrote:  

Good insights Athlone. The same is true in ALL of Latin America. Blacks and Amerindians are kept at the bottom while those that are white or can pass for white have inherited all the wealth and privilege. There ain't no Oprah in Latin America. They don't want to see a black woman on TV. Sadly, from what I've heard, even the blacks and browns don't want to see THEMSELVES on television. They prefer to see white actors. It's pretty much a lost cause down there. Black Latin activists can't mobilize people because nobody wants to be considered black. They'll call themselves something else. Mulatto or brown, or whatever. In the U.S., they didn't have that choice. A light skin black had to drink from the black fountain just like the dark ones. So it was easier to unify people to fight for their rights instead of the self-denial in Latin America. The One Drop Rule actually did us a big favor up here in that regards.

Btw, it's interesting that you'd refer to Malcolm X as "very light skinned", he looks kind of medium tone to me:



When I think of very light skinned I'm thinking of Sean Paul or the dude from Kid 'n Play:

Nah, X was light skinned. I always make fun of people who say Obama is half white as if that some how does not make him a black guy. Malcolm X was more "white" then Obama is, dare you say he was not a black man?

[playa_with_a_passport]

(08-15-2010 02:23 AM)Athlone McGinnis Wrote:  

That's the weird thing about brazil. You always hear about how tolerant and multi cultural the country is, but the status of black people there just confuses me.

Let's just talk about black people and what it means to be black hypothetically. If you use a stricter version of the american definition(perhaps excluding guys like Obama who had one or more predominantly caucasian parents), you're still left with the clear fact that Brazil has MANY more blacks than the US. You can make that definition as strict as you like, but this numerical advantage seems to remain true even if you limit it to more clearly visually black people(excluding really light skinned guys like Malcolm X, for example, and maybe using guys like the soccer star Maicon as an example of the visual cutoff). Ask yourself: where are these black people in Brazil?

You can find them acting sometimes. They do sing. There are plenty of them playing soccer(they seem to be a bit overepresented in this regard).
But you don't see any of them at high levels of government, business, education, etc, etc. The models are almost all towards the whiter end of the genetic spectrum. The money is concentrated amongst the lighter skinned in the country(favelas are filled with blacks). There aren't many at their elite schools(Ivy League schools, by comparison, are usually around 8% black at least).

There aren't(and haven't been, save for maybe one exception who I believe was a judge) any blacks at the president's side in government, and very few notable black politicians. Salvador da Bahia is over 80% black, and they have never had a black mayor. Think about this for a second, especially if you're American. Do you know of any major American city(population over 100,000) that has a majority black population but has not had a black mayor? All of the major cities with huge black populations in the US(Detroit, atlanta, Brimingham, etc) have hit this threshold LONG ago. And yet here is Salvador, a city of 3 million known worldwide for its Afro Brazillian cultural flavor, without a single black mayor. Not even one.

Think of the nation's largest companies and ask yourself how many Afro brazillians run them. I can name a few in the US where blacks are high up(American Express, Time Warner, etc). Can you do that in Brazil? I don't see many black executives at Telemar, Embraer or Petrobras.

Compare this to America. Here, we have had blacks in most of the major presidential cabinet positions. We have dozens of them in congress and we've had dozens more in the senate over time. There are at least half a dozen fortune 500 ceos I could name, more if I go include all who served within the last ten years and more still if I include other senior exectuives(COOs, Executive VPs, Managing Directors, etc). The black middle class in the US is much smaller than the white one here, but it is still highly visible. Its easy to tell its there, and that not every black person in this country lives in the ghetto.

Brazil just doesn't seem to have this at all. Sorry for the long rant, but that has always concerned me a bit. Its a perplexing(and kind of frustrating) phenomenon, especially examining it as a black person.

Excellent post, I just finished watching this Brazilian documentary called "Only When I Dance" it's about this poor Black ballerina from the Favelas of Rio who is trying to get into a foreign ballet company abroad because Brazillian ballet companies have an informal policy of not hiring Black Brazilians dancers. I was pleasantly surprised because this documentary discusses Brazilian institutional racism very bluntly instead of propagating the myth that Brazil is this big happy melting pot where everybody dances Samba all day. like Speakeasy said, this shit goes on in all of Latin America and even in Africa. I remember chopping it up with a Mexican in Greece and he telling me that there is a glass ceiling in Mexico career wise if you looked too "Indigenous" and because he was on the Indian side of the spectrum he was being shitted on. What I found shocking was that he thought this was acceptable and then he quickly asked me if I had any tips on fucking Blondes. Dominicans have a term for this, it's called "Mejorar la Raza." the literal translations means "improving the race." Their dictator at the time Trujillo (who was half Hatian) basically encourage every younger generation of Dominicans to try to have kids with the lightest person they can find so that each subsequent generations gets Whiter and whiter. Even till this day is very difficult for Black dudes to swoop dominican chicks in NY. This is a very good blog about an African American who has travelled in Latin america and writes about race relations in Latin America http://ahorasecreto.blogspot.com/

[Badstuber]

(08-15-2010 04:58 AM)IshGibbor Wrote:  

I always make fun of people who say Obama is half white as if that some how does not make him a black guy.

No, the problem is that people think he is 100% black, which he isn't.
It's funny how the media says that he is the first 'black' President of the US.

[MiXX]

(08-15-2010 09:27 AM)Badstuber Wrote:  

(08-15-2010 04:58 AM)IshGibbor Wrote:  

I always make fun of people who say Obama is half white as if that some how does not make him a black guy.

No, the problem is that people think he is 100% black, which he isn't.
It's funny how the media says that he is the first 'black' President of the US.

Another thing not many blacks that I personally interact with on a daily basis knew that Obama was raised in Indonesia, a predominantly Muslim country...and Obama also speaks fluent Indonesian as a secondary language.

I never got how Obama is publicly known as America's first black President...I would say he is America's first "mulatto" president 1/2 white.


Mixx

[playa_with_a_passport]

(08-15-2010 11:31 AM)MiXXmaster27 Wrote:  

(08-15-2010 09:27 AM)Badstuber Wrote:  

(08-15-2010 04:58 AM)IshGibbor Wrote:  

I always make fun of people who say Obama is half white as if that some how does not make him a black guy.

No, the problem is that people think he is 100% black, which he isn't.
It's funny how the media says that he is the first 'black' President of the US.

I never got how Obama is publicly known as America's first black President...I would say he is America's first "mulatto" president 1/2 white.


Mixx

He self identifies as Black, he wrote a whole book about it where he goes deeper as to why(Dreams from My father). Like Speakeasy said before before the civil rights movement if you had as much as one Black grandparent out of 4, you automatically were considered Black and had to drink from the "Black" fountain. The Surpreme Court actually ruled on this(Plessy v. Ferguson). Thus, ruling that Jim Crow laws apply to Plessy even thought he look 100% White because he had Black ancestors. This whole "I am Not Black but Mixed I want to Honor My White Heritage" idea is something that's relatively new, if 30 years ago someone like Tiger Woods would say the line "I am mixed" White people would tell him "Nigga please....".

[IshGibbor]

(08-15-2010 09:27 AM)Badstuber Wrote:  

(08-15-2010 04:58 AM)IshGibbor Wrote:  

I always make fun of people who say Obama is half white as if that some how does not make him a black guy.

No, the problem is that people think he is 100% black, which he isn't.
It's funny how the media says that he is the first 'black' President of the US.

There is no such thing as 100% black in America. Virtually all black people in America are mixed with European or some other ethnic group outside of Africa. Obama was not called 50% black in the black community, he was called light skinned (as black people call other black folks mixed with white). The media saw Obama as black because Americans saw Obama as black and he described himself as African American (who happend to live in the black as hell south side of chicago, marry a can't mistake for anything else but black woman, attended a black church for 20+ years and had two black daughters). Dude is black, end of story.

Ish

[IshGibbor]

(08-15-2010 12:37 PM)playa_with_a_passport Wrote:  

(08-15-2010 11:31 AM)MiXXmaster27 Wrote:  

(08-15-2010 09:27 AM)Badstuber Wrote:  

(08-15-2010 04:58 AM)IshGibbor Wrote:  

I always make fun of people who say Obama is half white as if that some how does not make him a black guy.

No, the problem is that people think he is 100% black, which he isn't.
It's funny how the media says that he is the first 'black' President of the US.

I never got how Obama is publicly known as America's first black President...I would say he is America's first "mulatto" president 1/2 white.


Mixx

He self identifies as Black, he wrote a whole book about it where he goes deeper as to why(Dreams from My father). Like Speakeasy said before before the civil rights movement if you had as much as one Black grandparent out of 4, you automatically were considered Black and had to drink from the "Black" fountain. The Surpreme Court actually ruled on this(Plessy v. Ferguson). Thus, ruling that Jim Crow laws apply to Plessy even thought he look 100% White because he had Black ancestors. This whole "I am Not Black but Mixed I want to Honor My White Heritage" idea is something that's relatively new, if 30 years ago someone like Tiger Woods would say the line "I am mixed" White people would tell him "Nigga please....".

Because a lot of white people want to take credit for anything of substance black people have done. I have never seen white people saying people who are half white are all of a sudden a new racial category in America. The vast majority of white folk up until Obama's success considered him black just like any other black person in the street. Now all of a sudden since he won the white house out comes the "but he is only half black" commentary, as if the ku klux klan would make the rope only half as long.

[speakeasy]

(08-15-2010 04:58 AM)IshGibbor Wrote:  

Nah, X was light skinned. I always make fun of people who say Obama is half white as if that some how does not make him a black guy. Malcolm X was more "white" then Obama is, dare you say he was not a black man?

X had a white grandfather. So he's 25% white. He's blacker than Obama who is 50% white. I just don't agree that X is light-skinned. Many, many blacks are lighter than he is.

[speakeasy]

(08-15-2010 09:27 AM)Badstuber Wrote:  

(08-15-2010 04:58 AM)IshGibbor Wrote:  

I always make fun of people who say Obama is half white as if that some how does not make him a black guy.

No, the problem is that people think he is 100% black, which he isn't.
It's funny how the media says that he is the first 'black' President of the US.

Well, all these racist whites claiming he isn't a "real American" sure don't care about him being half white.

[OGNorCal707]

I can see how the issue of race is more sensitive to black people, especially in America, but I personally don't get caught up in what makes you black or white, or mixed or whatever.

[Mrs. Chocolate]

Athlone: Congratulations, you are the first one to realize what happens for real here.
The thing is: In US, there were and still are several programs to include black, poor and other racial minorities in higher education and careers, such as scholarships. This does not exist here. If you are poor, you may get a little better, but not that much. Since that most of the poor people are black, it's just do the math.
When you are poor around here, there aren't much chances for even finish High School (around 16% of boys leave school earlier to go work) and go College (only 15% can get there). Therefore, is no way that a black person or aborigene can get a higher position in a company.
in the past 5 years ago, the governament created the PROUNI to enhance the entrance of poor students in the best universities (public or private, both ruled by middle and high classes) but it is not enough.

[Caramel Communist]

Watching No Country for Old Men on the iphone...doing work...I love the part where Anton says "If the rule you followed lead you to this? Then what was the point of the rule?" Woody Harrelson character just gives him the "what the fuck dude?"


Anyways it's pretty much a waste of time to feel sorry for those in the underclass based on color...they choose along with the mulatta's not to protest or rise up..until they put foot to ass nothing will change...

[playa_with_a_passport]

(08-16-2010 10:26 AM)Caramel Communist Wrote:  

Watching No Country for Old Men on the iphone...doing work...I love the part where Anton says "If the rule you followed lead you to this? Then what was the point of the rule?" Woody Harrelson character just gives him the "what the fuck dude?"


Anyways it's pretty much a waste of time to feel sorry for those in the underclass based on color...they choose along with the mulatta's not to protest or rise up..until they put foot to ass nothing will change...

Very good point, I don't feel sorry for Brazilian Blacks either. Racial equality wasn't given to Blacks in the US, it was DEMANDED by Blacks with their blood, sweat and tears. the Civil Right Act of 1964(Most Americans were dead against its passage) didn't get passed until Blacks got fed up of praying started burning shit to the ground in Major American cities. In the history of the world I don't think no ruling class has ever given up a piece of the economic pie voluntary. There are a ton of non violent ways for Blacks and Aboriginals to show Brazilian govt. they mean business specially with the World Cup and Olympics around the corner.

[Excelsior]

I can feel what you guys are saying about not feeling for brazilian blacks. The thing is that Latin America intrigues me. Its not only filled with beautiful women, but its got a pretty awesome culture. I want to go and see Brazillian cities, sports, and the way of life the people are used to there. Same with Colombia and Argentina.

Learning and understanding all that I have regarding the race relations in this place and the way black people are treated, however, almost makes me not want to bother anymore. I can go to Scandinavia, Australia, Western Europe and Japan and get plenty of culture, plenty of beautiful women and plenty of other awesome experiences. Why be a second class citizen in Brazil or Colombia when I have those other places to see? It just doesn't seem worth it, but that's just me.

[speakeasy]

This is an intriguing article on race in Brazil:

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/americas/6284806.stm

The thing is, it's hard to say who is really what in a place like Brazil. You can have a guy like Neguinho da Beija who looks like a normal black guy, but his DNA test reveal him to be mostly of European descent. Then you have someone like Adriana Lima who looks mostly European but still has a lot of black genes. Seu Jorge to me looks black as the ace of spades, I thought he was like pure African, but he's 15% white!

These DNA tests show that we aren't always what we think we are.

[thekiller]

(08-15-2010 09:27 AM)Badstuber Wrote:  

(08-15-2010 04:58 AM)IshGibbor Wrote:  

I always make fun of people who say Obama is half white as if that some how does not make him a black guy.

No, the problem is that people think he is 100% black, which he isn't.
It's funny how the media says that he is the first 'black' President of the US.

Especially since we all know The left's beloved Bill Clinton, was in fact, the first black President.

http://dir.salon.com/books/int/2002/02/2...index.html

[IshGibbor]

(08-18-2010 05:34 PM)Athlone McGinnis Wrote:  

I can feel what you guys are saying about not feeling for brazilian blacks. The thing is that Latin America intrigues me. Its not only filled with beautiful women, but its got a pretty awesome culture. I want to go and see Brazillian cities, sports, and the way of life the people are used to there. Same with Colombia and Argentina.

Learning and understanding all that I have regarding the race relations in this place and the way black people are treated, however, almost makes me not want to bother anymore. I can go to Scandinavia, Australia, Western Europe and Japan and get plenty of culture, plenty of beautiful women and plenty of other awesome experiences. Why be a second class citizen in Brazil or Colombia when I have those other places to see? It just doesn't seem worth it, but that's just me.

Don't believe the hype.

I am no doubt a person of color and I had Brazilian girls check me out and blow kisses at me on the street (and no I'm just not dat nigga I am not super attractive). I was American and they knew it which gives you high value (I am also mixed so I guess I was not "as black" as other folks). That said, you will have to stand out since if you are black (paper bag brown down to can't see you in the dark unless you smile black) then wear a style that will stand out.

I think this is where Mystery's peacocking or Brad P's sexy stereotype write ups could help (google them both). Both I have used in the past and both work effectively.

What you are looking to do is break the initial negative first impression a person has of your colored skin (if you are an African American then you are used to this by now) by showing your personality and laying down those words (game). It is just like any other girl after that, work the emotions, talk real loud, tell a joke, pick her up and spin her around, touch her, get her horny, escalate show her how masculine you are and then, fuck her. I had a good time, Brazilian girls are real sluts.



Ish Gibbor

[speakeasy]

@Ish

How are your Portuguese skills?

[IshGibbor]

(08-19-2010 04:26 AM)speakeasy Wrote:  

@Ish

How are your Portuguese skills?

Not that good. I just lucked out big time with attracting Brazilian women that spoke English. The only Brazilian girl I hooked up with that didn't speak English was a light skin girl I met touring the a favella in Bahia that made it so obvious she liked me only a complete asexual retard would not have sealed the deal. I have to mention I did luck out going on a study abroad with my college since we toured a lot of Universities (for educated related lectures) and got access to tons of educated Brazilian girls that spoke English. Walking on the streets of Brazil though I was getting my looks, smiles and did a lot of approaches (but hit a lot of walls with moments on girls that were into me but I couldn't bypass the language barrier).

I will know Portuguese the next time I visit.

Ish Gibbor

[IshGibbor]

(08-16-2010 12:48 AM)speakeasy Wrote:  

(08-15-2010 04:58 AM)IshGibbor Wrote:  

Nah, X was light skinned. I always make fun of people who say Obama is half white as if that some how does not make him a black guy. Malcolm X was more "white" then Obama is, dare you say he was not a black man?

X had a white grandfather. So he's 25% white. He's blacker than Obama who is 50% white. I just don't agree that X is light-skinned. Many, many blacks are lighter than he is.

All because you are 25% white doesn't necessarily mean you will look 25% white. It all depends on what genes show up. I know dark skin couples who had a tan baby since they had a white person's chromosome floating around somewhere in the family tree.

[Rocco81]

Damn this forum is the new Black planet. Im getting sick of this shit man, its why I've gone away for a couple weeks, came back and not missed one important pick up topic. Same old shit. yawn.

To clear up some shit here. Black as we define it in the Western world is Sub Saharan Africans. These are the typical Afro-American, Afro Brazilain and Carribean blacks. These are the blacks we find in the west, in Hip Hop, in NBA etc for you slower members.

Some northern Africans can be very dark Skinned but are not "Negro" or black as we say it here. Same as some Indians you see, like super black, but not with Negro features. If you are born an Albino negro, then you are still a negro. Simple. Its not about color, its about bone structire, hair, skin (not color) facial features.

I do get annoyed when people throw the term black around all the time when it benefits them. I mean Obama is part black and part white, and it does not matter who he identifies with. Its genes its race, you dont pick your parents. Why dont we call Tiger half asian and 1/4 white 1/4 black? I mean to me he looks more Asian / Polynesian than white or black to me. Why is it when a half black man gets somewhere in the world, they say he is is black?

I hate to sound like this, but if people really want to be equal then start acting like it. Clean up your own back yard first. When you are black and pick up women, then welcome lets share some ideas. Im sure there are some whites, asians, latinos etc. here that could use your help in meeting black girls as well as white girls However some of this shit I'm seeing on the forum and Roosh's page post about race is fucked. "Black power, yeah fucking allll the white bitches in " da w3rld yeaaaa all white bitches crave all black dudes.... " give me a break man. Maybe I just gave some of you guys too much credit or maybe I really am on a forum with a bunch af 15 year olds.

[clr]

amen Rocco, I used to joke when people in NYC would say we elected a black president, like that was why they voted, I said that we elected a half white president, people are waaaayyyyyy stupid over race shit. People make it a big deal, its not. Let it drop and let people live their lives.