[Keyser Söze]

Recently, as I have been reevaluating how I will train and what my fitness goals are for my 30s, and I bought Tim Ferriss's 4 HR Body, and read it and had some concerns, and went online and found a well done review of the book that I posted below.
I've spent most of my life as an athlete and active person. I have at various times used a variety of different supplements, vitamins, steroids, diets, and training methods.
My feeling lately has been that 99.99% of it is total bullshit.
Even Omega 3 oil supplementation, which has been a big thing for me the past couple years, appears to offer no benefit according to a recent study.
Also, most of any multi vitamin you take gets pissed right out, as your body can only use so much of certain things and they are more readily absorbed from natural sources.
With this in mind, I have a pretty good idea what my future workouts and diet will look like.
I am not going to take any supplements of any kind, unless medically necessary.
I will cook most of my own food (primarily quinoa or brown rice, and some wild caught fish or skinless free range chicken), will have fresh fruit and vegetables, and will have a workout routine more or less of the following - approx an hour per day of cardio which will freely rotate between running/swimming/sports, and then strength training (free weights, resistence exercises, abs) for 30-45 min 3-4 times a week.
If it looks like a gimmick, smells like a gimmick, then it is probably a gimmick.
Although I must say I sincerely admire Tim Ferriss' skill as a salesman, there is a lot to be learned that is applicable to business, as he is a master at self promotion, gaming the amazon review system, and legally making millions by appealing to people's laziness (BrainQUICKEN, 4HR, etc).

3,341 of 3,648 people found the following review helpful
4 Hour Baloney, save your money February 22, 2011
By N. Watson
Format:Hardcover|Amazon Verified Purchase

Most of the 5-star reviews for 4HB came up on the first day. Given that Tim Ferriss has previously endorsed outsourcing in his Four Hour Workweek, I wonder how many of those 5-star reviews were from his personal assistants abroad.

Let me start with my bona fides: I am a currently practicing and licensed physician in the state of California. I graduated from Stanford University School of Medicine. I am a black belt and a lifelong athlete, and I have been weight training for over 20 years-- and unlike Mr. Ferriss, without injuring myself in any way, ever. I have no financial interest in his book or any other product discussed here.

Regarding the depth of my review of The 4-Hour Body, I spent over [...] on the equipment, supplements, and ultrasound machine recommended in the book. I bought the BodyMetrix Professional ultrasound and software he recommends by Intelametrix ([...] after discount for mentioning 4HB book), and completed the 1-on-1 online training despite the fact I am previously certified in performing ultrasound. I engaged my friends and colleagues in a "Fat off" competition with obsessive and objective weight and body fat measurements and followed the routine for 5 weeks as perfectly as I was able. I also experimented (like Mr. Ferriss) using continuous glucose measurement (CGM) to assess minute-to-minute glucose responses to food and exercise using both the DexCom system he recommends as well as the MiniMed Guardian system. I plan to upload a photo of the nutritional supplements I bought, which nearly cover my kitchen table. I downloaded apps to my phone for recording each workout obsessively, and more importantly to help with the very slow rep time he recommends.

My basic finding is that after trying the diet, supplements, exercise routines and lifestyle changes recommended in the 4-Hour Body that I found no change, whatsoever, in body weight or competition. Nor did any of my other friends trying the book.

Why doesn't the 4HB work?

(1) It takes more than 4 hours a month in the gym to have a great body. I'm sorry, it just does. Mr. Ferriss recommends performing 2-3 SETS, for a total of less than 30 reps, per WEEK, to get a great body. Ask any athlete, bodybuilder, trainer... not enough. Not even close. It's hogwash. I actually could feel my body dwindling despite eating as much protein as I could stomach.

(2) Almost all the supplements recommended in 4HB have never been scientifically proven to do what Mr. Ferriss claims they do. Take cissus quadrangularis (page 110), costs about $30 for 120 capsules. He discusses that he took CQ in China while eating a high volume rice diet with sweets and states "CQ preserved my abs". Really? If that's the level of evidence that you're comfortable with, great. But with simultaneous exercise, multiple other ongoing supplements, lifestyle changes, etc., who can tell whether it was CQ or just dietary changes from his being in rural China?

(3) The diet is just a mishmash of other diet routines, basically Atkins plus paleo with a dash of South Beach Diet. There are important flaws in the diet that should be pointed out. He recommends carbohydrates from beans instead of "white carbohydrates", hence the "slow-carb" diet. This relies on a bunch of old data regarding glycemic index. The reality about carbohydrate digestion is very different. Carbohydrate digestion is so important that it begins IN THE MOUTH with salivary amylase. Whether you eat a slice of Wonder Bread or a handful of garbanzo beans, the breakdown of these sugars into the body's currency of glucose is extremely rapid and effective regardless of which form you ingest it in. I have tried this myself using continuous glucose monitoring as recommended in the book. The only way I have found to blunt the sugar rise is simultaneous ingestion of a good quantity of fat. Also, can a diet really be paleo without milk or dairy? And did early Homo sapiens farm for beans and lentils?

(4) The blood sugar response data in the book is flawed by a misunderstanding of how continuous blood glucose monitoring (CGM) works. He notes "it turned out foods and liquids took much, much longer to get to my bloodstream than one would expect." But the DexCom SEVEN implant he was using has a 20-30 minute delay between the blood sugar reading you get on a finger stick, and the blood sugar reading on the machine sensor. That is, there is a BUILT IN DELAY (check some online diabetic forums for more info on this) because capillary blood from fingersticks shows changes much faster and more accurately than the interstitial fluid surrounding the implant. So, as noted in (3), sugar responses are actually very fast. Drink that protein shake right before or after the workout, not 1 hour prior like he says.

(5) Measuring body fat before and after interventions is much less easy than implied in the book. Body scans using DEXA are really great, but it's hard to convince all your friends to do it with you given inconvenience and expense. I have used the ultrasound unit he recommends and even with training it is very difficult for me to get reliable, repeatable data. This is true even when I have switched it to expert "M" mode and done my own curve fitting of the actual ultrasound output. It is also very dependent on the body type you select for yourself when you calibrate the machine.

(6) The sex improvement section seems out of place in this book, and is not terribly original to boot.

Here's what you can learn from 4HB without buying the book:
---Measure your body fat (!) before and after any change you make in your diet.
---If a book makes unrealistic claims, don't believe it.
---Have your friends join you in challenges and short contests.
---Exercise consistently over years...and be more careful with your body than Mr. Ferriss is.

[Deluge]

The book defies all logic. I feel sorry for suckers who believed it. It's unfit for publication and Tim Ferris only wrote it to cash in on his success with the 4hr Workweek and we all know it.

EDIT: The threat title is so long you need to delete part of it in the subject line to reply.

[Kitsune]

Like the 4 hour work-week, it has some good ideas if you take them completely out of context and evaluate it all as you would the work of a snake oil salesman.

Even the placebo effect works.

[Keyser Söze]

Too late for me to edit thread title, if a mod wants to, go ahead.

I think there is a lot of value in Tim Ferriss' work, if you are comfortable with making money ( or winning Chinese martial arts tournaments, etc) by any legal means necessary without any moral calculations made.

For the most part I am, but I don't derive pleasure out of it, I just do what's neccessary. However, TF seems to enjoy doing it, and to feel just as much pleasure from winning with a shortcut as winning through fair play. Maybe he just rubs me the wrong way, but the parts of his personality I have perceived through his books and some clips on youtube, are fairly nauseating.

[Giovonny]

(04-25-2012 06:53 AM)Keyser Söze Wrote:  

My feeling lately has been that 99.99% of it is total bullshit.

Welcome to the "red pill" of health and fitness!

99% of what you hear is marketing bullshit designed to sell you something.

Your instinct is correct.

(04-25-2012 06:53 AM)Keyser Söze Wrote:  

I will cook most of my own food (primarily quinoa or brown rice, and some wild caught fish or skinless free range chicken), will have fresh fruit and vegetables, and will have a workout routine more or less of the following - approx an hour per day of cardio which will freely rotate between running/swimming/sports, and then strength training (free weights, resistence exercises, abs) for 30-45 min 3-4 times a week.

So you will eat mostly quinoa, brown rice, wild caught fish, free range chicken, and fruits and vegetables.

Beautiful! Your diet will be better then 99% of the people on earth.

And, you will do some moderate cardio and strength training.

Perfect!

Nice job navigating the bullshit and finding reality!

Also, don't forget the other important things which are, lots of good sleep, lots of good water, and a low stress lifestyle.

[sheesh]

(04-25-2012 06:53 AM)Keyser Söze Wrote:  

I've spent most of my life as an athlete and active person. I have at various times used a variety of different supplements, vitamins, steroids, diets, and training methods.
My feeling lately has been that 99.99% of it is total bullshit.

This is what I have been saying in several posts on this forum...99% of the health advice by these so called gurus is garbage.

Most supplements are garbage, overpriced and sometimes even harmful.

[Walnuts]

I noticed a lack of red meat in your planned diet.
Where are you going to get your creatine?

[finton_the_toole]

There's one good piece of information in 4HB, it's this:

"Measure everything".

Measure your food, so you know what your macro break down is. Understand what you are putting into your mouth and what the macro make up of it is. Measure your training so you know where you stand: how much can you lift, at what intensity, how intensively can you do your cardio. Measure your body composition (buy a body composition monitor - they are not great, but they give you an idea) and keep track.

There you have it. Now you don't have to read the book.

As for food, skinless chicken breast (yes I do eat it about once a week), is a travesty of food. It so easily ends up dry and disgusting. There are only two ways of cooking it that don't involve adding fat. Other ways, for example smearing it with pesto, just adds back the fat that you tried to avoid by removing the skin. Duh! Might as well have eaten the yummy crispy skin in the first place.

If you are lean and mean there is nothing wrong with a bit of fat. I eat a range of meats some fatty, some not so. You just need to be aware of the kind of food you're eating and how much of it, so you can end up with a balanced diet.

[Keyser Söze]

(04-26-2012 05:01 AM)Walnuts Wrote:  

I noticed a lack of red meat in your planned diet.
Where are you going to get your creatine?

Red meat consumption is neither necessary nor is it a overall benefit.

The closest thing to a perfect natural human diet is probably what Japanese men in coastal villages in Okinawa eat.

[dulst]

Question about your new diet plan, where's the fat?

[Keyser Söze]

(04-26-2012 08:26 AM)dulst Wrote:  

Question about your new diet plan, where's the fat?

Salmon and chicken both have fat. There are also different kinds of fat.

Ever wonder why sugar and fat taste so good? It's not an accident. It's evolution. For most of human history, getting the potent energy packed goodness of fat or sugar was rather challenging (many cultures depended on very inefficient food sources), and it makes sense that our brain's pleasure centers would light up at the presence of these things, so that they were consumed.

[ManAbout]

(04-25-2012 06:53 AM)Keyser Söze Wrote:  

He recommends carbohydrates from beans instead of "white carbohydrates", hence the "slow-carb" diet. This relies on a bunch of old data regarding glycemic index. The reality about carbohydrate digestion is very different. Carbohydrate digestion is so important that it begins IN THE MOUTH with salivary amylase. Whether you eat a slice of Wonder Bread or a handful of garbanzo beans, the breakdown of these sugars into the body's currency of glucose is extremely rapid and effective regardless of which form you ingest it in. I have tried this myself using continuous glucose monitoring as recommended in the book. The only way I have found to blunt the sugar rise is simultaneous ingestion of a good quantity of fat. Also, can a diet really be paleo without milk or dairy? And did early Homo sapiens farm for beans and lentils?

Sorry I am not buying this. This whole paragraph makes it seem like he is just another mouthpiece for the Weston A Price foundation. There is no way that white bread and garbanzo beans will raise your blood sugar at the same rate. Will there be a glycemic response from eating beans and lentils? Yes. But, there also be one from drinking milk and eating dairy, but he has no problem recommending those. I don't need to use coninuous glucose monitoring to tell me that there is a difference between eating beans and bread. I can see it on my body. When I eat more bread, even whole wheat bread I can gain more fat. It doesn't happen when I eat just beans and lentils.

[finton_the_toole]

For those of us who aren't diabetic, the whole GI thing is a load of pointless nonsense. The secret is this: Count your calories.

As for low fat diets these were a disaster for me, because I'd get cravings. If I have at least 60g fat/day, I'm fine though. Personally, I'm against ultra-low fat diets because of my experience. Cutting carbs though is easy.

[Keyser Söze]

(04-26-2012 09:35 AM)ManAbout Wrote:  

(04-25-2012 06:53 AM)Keyser Söze Wrote:  

He recommends carbohydrates from beans instead of "white carbohydrates", hence the "slow-carb" diet. This relies on a bunch of old data regarding glycemic index. The reality about carbohydrate digestion is very different. Carbohydrate digestion is so important that it begins IN THE MOUTH with salivary amylase. Whether you eat a slice of Wonder Bread or a handful of garbanzo beans, the breakdown of these sugars into the body's currency of glucose is extremely rapid and effective regardless of which form you ingest it in. I have tried this myself using continuous glucose monitoring as recommended in the book. The only way I have found to blunt the sugar rise is simultaneous ingestion of a good quantity of fat. Also, can a diet really be paleo without milk or dairy? And did early Homo sapiens farm for beans and lentils?

Sorry I am not buying this. This whole paragraph makes it seem like he is just another mouthpiece for the Weston A Price foundation. There is no way that white bread and garbanzo beans will raise your blood sugar at the same rate. Will there be a glycemic response from eating beans and lentils? Yes. But, there also be one from drinking milk and eating dairy, but he has no problem recommending those. I don't need to use coninuous glucose monitoring to tell me that there is a difference between eating beans and bread. I can see it on my body. When I eat more bread, even whole wheat bread I can gain more fat. It doesn't happen when I eat just beans and lentils.

You know, I'm more likely to rely on the advice of the guy who spent years and years studying basic science, human anatomy, etc at Stanford Medical School, rather than your personal intuition.

[ABDada]

Starting May 1st I'm switching to Martin Berkhan's LeanGains system after softly trying it out over the past month. I don't want to be bulky like Martin, just with a lot more muscle ton and cut my body fat a few more percentage points.

For me, I went from 205# to 165# doing Atkins for years and never felt "right". Switched to a Primal/Paleo perspective to go from 165# to 145# and hit 10% body fat with ease -- and no exercise.

Getting rid of cardio helped me a TON. I can't begin to imagine ever going back, the cortisol response to cardio with my body (n=1) was terrible, inflammatory, and pro-fat gain.

I actually stopped eating fruits and noticed an immediate improvement in lowered lethargy -- I might be fructose malabsorptive (getting tested for it today, actually). I added white rice and white potatoes per Dr. Kurt Harris' personal suggestion, and that's helped me increase my strength to places I've never been before (100% body weight bench press).

I work out few little -- 10 minutes, 3 times per week, tops. I do a lot of outdoor playing, though (frisbee with the guys, paddleboarding in Chicago, surfing in California, beach volleyball in Florida, tree-climbing with the dames, etc) but it's not cardio nor heavy exercise, just outdoors in the sunshine, playing.

The supplements I take are:

1. Vitamin D in winter, mega doses. I travel at least 2-3 times per winter for weekends to get some real sunlight, too.
2. BCAAs during fastest workout. 10g before a workout.
3. Calcium. When my testosterone dropped in my early 30s, my doctor recommended calcium. Seems to have helped, but it's anecdotal.
4. Caffeine. Coffee and tea only, never a tablet.

Between the LeanGains style IF (16 hour fast, 8 hour eating window), fasted workouts (10 minutes, tops, 3 times per week), and an overall "whole real food" menu with no lectins (no beans, no wheat), I feel 20 years younger, and I constantly get compliments on my physique when I travel to areas with pools or beaches.

Now it's time to get summer shredded, and I think the LeanGains program should get me there with just 10 minutes extra per day work-out.

No way in hell will I work out an hour a day -- it's not something I could keep up for life; I want my diet and exercise program to work for the rest of my life.

[ManAbout]

(04-26-2012 09:53 AM)Keyser Söze Wrote:  

You know, I'm more likely to rely on the advice of the guy who spent years and years studying basic science, human anatomy, etc at Stanford Medical School, rather than your personal intuition.

How do you know he studied at Stanford Medical School? This is the internet, anybody can claim to be anything and anybody.

Do you actually think that beans and white bread are the same? I find that shocking.

[Giovonny]

(04-26-2012 05:55 AM)finton_the_toole Wrote:  

skinless chicken breast (yes I do eat it about once a week), is a travesty of food. It so easily ends up dry and disgusting.

Yes, chicken breasts can be tough to cook if you want to keep it a juicy, flavorful.

I think the best thing to do is to slice it thin. This was it cooks up very fast and maintains most of the moisture. Cooking a full size chicken breast properly can be tough for an inexperienced chef.

Here is a great way to do it:

[Docter]

(04-26-2012 06:55 AM)Keyser Söze Wrote:  

(04-26-2012 05:01 AM)Walnuts Wrote:  

I noticed a lack of red meat in your planned diet.
Where are you going to get your creatine?

Red meat consumption is neither necessary nor is it a overall benefit.

The closest thing to a perfect natural human diet is probably what Japanese men in coastal villages in Okinawa eat.

While I agree that no food item is necessary per se, I do personally believe that beef and red meat are more nutritious than fowl (assuming you're getting good quality grass-fed no hormone/antibiotic stuff). My primary reason? It just tastes better, and our tongues evolved to like shit for a reason. I see no reason NOT to eat it.

Be careful with your second statement. The perfect natural human diet for the men in the costal villages of Okinawa is the diet of the costal villages in Okinawa. If you're lineage is from Russia, it's going to be different. I'm a Jew, and I cannot handle dairy. The idea that there's an optimum diet, one-size-fits-all, for everyone is bullshit. You have to just experiment, try new foods, and track how you feel.

As far as Tim Ferriss's book goes, I like to believe he isn't in it completely for the cash. The amount of content that he created (the book went through A LOT of editing -- he has a lot more data and information the had to cut out) leads me to believe that it wasn't just a sales effort.

He made a comment recently like "the 4-hour-work-week helps people realize they can control their work reality, and I wanted to show that you can also control your physical reality." In this regard, I think he's succeeded.

Here's my 2 cents:
Eat whole foods. Sleep. Sex. Stress free. Smile. Water. That'll take you far.

[Keyser Söze]

(04-26-2012 10:00 AM)ManAbout Wrote:  

(04-26-2012 09:53 AM)Keyser Söze Wrote:  

You know, I'm more likely to rely on the advice of the guy who spent years and years studying basic science, human anatomy, etc at Stanford Medical School, rather than your personal intuition.

How do you know he studied at Stanford Medical School? This is the internet, anybody can claim to be anything and anybody.

Do you actually think that beans and white bread are the same? I find that shocking.

this is his verified Amazon profile - http://www.amazon.com/gp/pdp/profile/A1U..._cr_dp_pdp
this is what I found in a 2 second google search : http://www.ucomparehealthcare.com/drs/nathan_t_watson/

As for beans and whitebread being the same...I don't really know the details of how the body breaks down food and where and when the chemical reactions occur.

[Keyser Söze]

(04-26-2012 11:36 AM)Giovonny Wrote:  

(04-26-2012 05:55 AM)finton_the_toole Wrote:  

skinless chicken breast (yes I do eat it about once a week), is a travesty of food. It so easily ends up dry and disgusting.

Yes, chicken breasts can be tough to cook if you want to keep it a juicy, flavorful.

I think the best thing to do is to slice it thin. This was it cooks up very fast and maintains most of the moisture. Cooking a full size chicken breast properly can be tough for an inexperienced chef.

Here is a great way to do it:

That's good. I would just make a couple points - the sparing use of olive oil can add a lot of flavor.
Also, the best way to improve flavor is to use practically calorie free herbs and spices - I like saffron on rice, and fiery spices and tabasco on everything else.

[Keyser Söze]

(04-26-2012 12:10 PM)Docter Wrote:  

(04-26-2012 06:55 AM)Keyser Söze Wrote:  

(04-26-2012 05:01 AM)Walnuts Wrote:  

I noticed a lack of red meat in your planned diet.
Where are you going to get your creatine?

Red meat consumption is neither necessary nor is it a overall benefit.

The closest thing to a perfect natural human diet is probably what Japanese men in coastal villages in Okinawa eat.

While I agree that no food item is necessary per se, I do personally believe that beef and red meat are more nutritious than fowl (assuming you're getting good quality grass-fed no hormone/antibiotic stuff). My primary reason? It just tastes better, and our tongues evolved to like shit for a reason. I see no reason NOT to eat it.

Be careful with your second statement. The perfect natural human diet for the men in the costal villages of Okinawa is the diet of the costal villages in Okinawa. If you're lineage is from Russia, it's going to be different. I'm a Jew, and I cannot handle dairy. The idea that there's an optimum diet, one-size-fits-all, for everyone is bullshit. You have to just experiment, try new foods, and track how you feel.

As far as Tim Ferriss's book goes, I like to believe he isn't in it completely for the cash. The amount of content that he created (the book went through A LOT of editing -- he has a lot more data and information the had to cut out) leads me to believe that it wasn't just a sales effort.

He made a comment recently like "the 4-hour-work-week helps people realize they can control their work reality, and I wanted to show that you can also control your physical reality." In this regard, I think he's succeeded.

Here's my 2 cents:
Eat whole foods. Sleep. Sex. Stress free. Smile. Water. That'll take you far.

Sorry, I think he went for a straight cash grab this time. Which is fine, I would probably do the same in his position.
How much of the writing and editing do you think he actually did?
Also, I got a very strong feeling that TF didn't start from thinking, "hey, how can I make a book that will be useful and practical for people who want to improve their health?"
Rather, the book seems to be designed to point out what a cool dude TF is, what cool things he does to his dude body, how he and his friends are so dudely.
His obssessiveness with recording his workouts over years is something I have very rarely seen outside of serious powerlifters. I think he is the kind of guy who looks at himself in the mirror while jerking off.

About different diets for different people, you are right for the most part. However anything beyond sporadic consumption of red meat raises your risk of heart disease and some kinds of cancer considerably http://www.webmd.com/food-recipes/featur...t-red-meat

[finton_the_toole]

(04-26-2012 11:36 AM)Giovonny Wrote:  

(04-26-2012 05:55 AM)finton_the_toole Wrote:  

skinless chicken breast (yes I do eat it about once a week), is a travesty of food. It so easily ends up dry and disgusting.

Yes, chicken breasts can be tough to cook if you want to keep it a juicy, flavorful.

I think the best thing to do is to slice it thin. This was it cooks up very fast and maintains most of the moisture. Cooking a full size chicken breast properly can be tough for an inexperienced chef.

Here is a great way to do it:

Nice, but he's breading and frying it, which will soak up lots of fat, and the whole point of eating skinless chicken breast is to have a high protein, low fat meal, isn't it? Otherwise just cook it with skin on. IMVHO.

[Giovonny]

(04-26-2012 12:16 PM)Keyser Söze Wrote:  

the sparing use of olive oil can add a lot of flavor.

Also, the best way to improve flavor is to use practically calorie free herbs and spices

Yes, thats what I use most times, olive oil, herbs and spices.

And, I make my own hot sauce with roasted and blended tomatoes, onion, and hot peppers.

(04-26-2012 12:21 PM)finton_the_toole Wrote:  

Nice, but he's breading and frying it, which will soak up lots of fat, and the whole point of eating skinless chicken breast is to have a high protein, low fat meal, isn't it? Otherwise just cook it with skin on. IMVHO.

Fair enough. Though, this isn't so much frying as it is sauteing in olive oil. But, you are right, it would he healthier to bake, grill, or BBQ the chicken. I use just a little olive oil so the fat is not really a concern.

[ManAbout]

(04-26-2012 12:14 PM)Keyser Söze Wrote:  

As for beans and whitebread being the same...I don't really know the details of how the body breaks down food and where and when the chemical reactions occur.

You don't need to be a stanford qualified doctor to come to the conclusion that nutritionally white bread and beans are not on the same planet. The fact that he is trying to equate the two while promoting milk, which also has a similar insulin response to beans and lentils, a pass makes me think that he has some agenda.

[finton_the_toole]

(04-26-2012 12:23 PM)Giovonny Wrote:  

(04-26-2012 12:16 PM)Keyser Söze Wrote:  

the sparing use of olive oil can add a lot of flavor.

Also, the best way to improve flavor is to use practically calorie free herbs and spices

Yes, thats what I use most times, olive oil, herbs and spices.

And, I make my own hot sauce with roasted and blended tomatoes, onion, and hot peppers.

(04-26-2012 12:21 PM)finton_the_toole Wrote:  

Nice, but he's breading and frying it, which will soak up lots of fat, and the whole point of eating skinless chicken breast is to have a high protein, low fat meal, isn't it? Otherwise just cook it with skin on. IMVHO.

Fair enough. Though, this isn't so much frying as it is sauteing in olive oil. But, you are right, it would he healthier to bake, grill, or BBQ the chicken. I use just a little olive oil so the fat is not really a concern.

The two methods I use to keep the chicken moist, whilst adding no fat are a) boil the chicken (if you're being posh you call this poaching) and b) put in a aluminium foil parcel with loads of veggies (which add moisture) make sure it's air tight and bake.