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Monogamy and/or Cheating - Chewbacon - 10-19-2011
Two-part question:
1) For those of you who are in exclusive relationships and DO NOT cheat, how do you like it? I'm assuming you are in a healthy and satisfying relationship where you are the alpha male, get lots of sex, etc etc. But I'm curious for those who are faithful - do you get tempted? Do you think on the whole it's better than being single? Having mistresses? Just having a fwb? How's the grass on the other side?
2) For those of you who are in exclusive relationships but DO cheat, how do you feel? Do you still enjoy your main girl? Do you feel guilty? Do you find the sneaking around inconvenient? Is it worth it?
[edit]
Monogamy and/or Cheating - Moma - 10-19-2011
Quote: (10-19-2011 02:40 PM)SHANbangs Wrote:
Two-part question:
1) For those of you who are in exclusive relationships and DO NOT cheat, how do you like it? I'm assuming you are in a healthy and satisfying relationship where you are the alpha male, get lots of sex, etc etc. But I'm curious for those who are faithful - do you get tempted? Do you think on the whole it's better than being single? Having mistresses? Just having a fwb? How's the grass on the other side?
2) For those of you who are in exclusive relationships but DO cheat, how do you feel? Do you still enjoy your main girl? Do you feel guilty? Do you find the sneaking around inconvenient? Is it worth it?
I ask because I just got into an exclusive relationship. However, I'm still not at a point in my game that I'm satisfied with. There are also lots of girls I meet on campus. At the same time, I quite like the girl I'm dating and wouldn't want to hurt her. I would feel pretty guilty about cheating. But, having never done it before, I have no idea how I would ACTUALLY feel if I did cheat.
Why did you get into an exclusive relationship if you are not ready via your game? Are you settling? There is no benefit in settling, Shan.
I've been in an 'exclusive' relationship before and I've stepped out to hit something new. How did I feel? A tad guilty but I rationalised things in my head. As a man you are supposed to hit new things. The same way lizards get bored doing the same things, men get bored doing the same 'thing'.
The same way lizards need new dresses, shoes and doll themselves up to renew themselves, a man needs to dig out something new to renew himself. This is human nature. I've met lizards that understand that.
Ideally, you want to meet a lizard that understands a man's nature and allows him that space.
Old Nemesis has the perfect spouse for that. Holla at him for the psychology behind it.
But I feel you are already CHEATING if you are locking yourself down with a lizard if your game isn't tight enough.
Monogamy and/or Cheating - Saladin - 10-19-2011
IF you have moral qualms just break up with her. Your personal development is far more important than having a comfortable relationship. If you don't have any moral problems cheating on her go ahead and keep gaming on the side to get pussy. Just remember that word can get around quick if you're cheating on your girl in her environment with girls that go the same school as her.
Monogamy and/or Cheating - Chewbacon - 10-19-2011
Quote: (10-19-2011 03:01 PM)Moma Wrote:
Quote: (10-19-2011 02:40 PM)SHANbangs Wrote:
Two-part question:
1) For those of you who are in exclusive relationships and DO NOT cheat, how do you like it? I'm assuming you are in a healthy and satisfying relationship where you are the alpha male, get lots of sex, etc etc. But I'm curious for those who are faithful - do you get tempted? Do you think on the whole it's better than being single? Having mistresses? Just having a fwb? How's the grass on the other side?
2) For those of you who are in exclusive relationships but DO cheat, how do you feel? Do you still enjoy your main girl? Do you feel guilty? Do you find the sneaking around inconvenient? Is it worth it?
I ask because I just got into an exclusive relationship. However, I'm still not at a point in my game that I'm satisfied with. There are also lots of girls I meet on campus. At the same time, I quite like the girl I'm dating and wouldn't want to hurt her. I would feel pretty guilty about cheating. But, having never done it before, I have no idea how I would ACTUALLY feel if I did cheat.
Why did you get into an exclusive relationship if you are not ready via your game? Are you settling? There is no benefit in settling, Shan.
I've been in an 'exclusive' relationship before and I've stepped out to hit something new. How did I feel? A tad guilty but I rationalised things in my head. As a man you are supposed to hit new things. The same way lizards get bored doing the same things, men get bored doing the same 'thing'.
The same way lizards need new dresses, shoes and doll themselves up to renew themselves, a man needs to dig out something new to renew himself. This is human nature. I've met lizards that understand that.
Ideally, you want to meet a lizard that understands a man's nature and allows him that space.
Old Nemesis has the perfect spouse for that. Holla at him for the psychology behind it.
But I feel you are already CHEATING if you are locking yourself down with a lizard if your game isn't tight enough.
Hey Moma,
I know it sounds like I'm settling but I'm not. Looks wise, she's in the range that I like ie. an 8 (if you know me, 9 and 10 is reserved for celebrity/supermodel status), great personality, very positive, down to earth. If this had been 7 months ago, when you and I first chatted, I would have said that I was settling, because I didn't like the other girl I was dating as much. I did the logical thing then and broke up with her. Unfortunately, I really like this current girl - so a bit of a catch 22. Also, I would be settling if it were a quality issue, but it's not. My thirst for other women has nothing to do with sexual quality and everything to do with sexual variety. I may have my filet mignon, but sometimes I crave sushi, hamburgers, and falafel.
Monogamy and/or Cheating - peterthephoenix - 10-19-2011
Hey Shan,
I'm 20 years old. Been in a relationship for 7 months. I don't cheat, I feel it's bad karma because I wouldn't want her doing it to me.
I feel like having a girlfriend has given me the ability to develop other areas of my life (friends, hobbies) while having a guarantee of regular pussy. I also get to develop my sexual ability with a trusted partner.
Also it's satisfying having a girl who cares for you deeply and does some really cool shit for you.
Monogamy and/or Cheating - Chewbacon - 10-19-2011
Hey peter,
thanks for the input. Ya, I also think that having a gf by itself does not preclude working on your game - you can practice pretty much everything except for the seduction.
Monogamy and/or Cheating - Moma - 10-20-2011
Quote: (10-19-2011 08:14 PM)SHANbangs Wrote:
Hey peter,
thanks for the input. Ya, I also think that having a gf by itself does not preclude working on your game - you can practice pretty much everything except for the seduction.
I personally think that having a gf DOES preclude working on your game. Game has a beginning, a middle and an end to the process.
You don't have to bang her in the end but you definitely need to see if you are able to get her to private quarters and naked or even making out to see if your game works.
If you are talking about pillow talk with her on the phone and going out on platonic dates, I'm not sure that constitutes as game.
Of course, I could be wrong and I am open to correction.
Explain your concept of game without ANY form of intimacy.
If you mean that you will work them up to a heavy kiss close and abandon them because you don't want to cheat on your girl then maybe I would concur that is game (to a certain degree).
Pls elaborate.
Monogamy and/or Cheating - FretDancer - 10-20-2011
Many advantages and disadvantages in your situation Shan, I guess its normal to feel guilty, hell I would to. Its also pretty normal to want to fuck other girls, its in our biology.
My advice, try getting the most out of the advantages you can actually get if you get exclusive with this chick. Also try working on your game with her as much as you can, even if you are limited (because you will be), and also with other girls, you decide if you will proceed to bang or not.
I say give it a try for a few months and then come up with a decission based on the experience, what can you lose?
Monogamy and/or Cheating - Chewbacon - 10-21-2011
Quote: (10-20-2011 07:26 AM)Moma Wrote:
Quote: (10-19-2011 08:14 PM)SHANbangs Wrote:
Hey peter,
thanks for the input. Ya, I also think that having a gf by itself does not preclude working on your game - you can practice pretty much everything except for the seduction.
I personally think that having a gf DOES preclude working on your game. Game has a beginning, a middle and an end to the process.
You don't have to bang her in the end but you definitely need to see if you are able to get her to private quarters and naked or even making out to see if your game works.
If you are talking about pillow talk with her on the phone and going out on platonic dates, I'm not sure that constitutes as game.
Of course, I could be wrong and I am open to correction.
Explain your concept of game without ANY form of intimacy.
If you mean that you will work them up to a heavy kiss close and abandon them because you don't want to cheat on your girl then maybe I would concur that is game (to a certain degree).
Pls elaborate.
Moma, I beginning game is just the most challenging for me, so working on approaching and attraction building + number closing is what i'm looking at. For me anyways, all of my successful opens have led to successful ends ie. sex. I'm relatively comfortable knowing what to do once I've assumed attraction. Of course, I have never pulled a SNL, so my SNL practice would indeed have to be put on the backburner.
Monogamy and/or Cheating - oldnemesis - 10-21-2011
Explain what do you mean by cheating. Is it fucking others while having your girl believe you're only fucking her? Or it also covers fucking others but letting your girl know you fuck others?
Monogamy and/or Cheating - K-man - 10-21-2011
What the hell, it ain't cheating before you've put the ring on her finger. She's just your girlfriend - how many girlfriends have you had before, and how many future ones will you have - is she the ONE? If not, then it ain't cheating. You two are just test-driving yourselves anyway. You aren't her first boyfriend either, I suppose?
Now, if you are married, there are a few threads about married men and cheating/gaming girls. Just search for them, some good insights there, incl. from Old Nemesis, Lothario, DocSedated, and myself.
Monogamy and/or Cheating - Gmac - 10-21-2011
If you AGREE to be exclusive with a girl, it's cheating any way you look at it. Rationalize it however you want, you'll still be wrong. Women do that shit, don't be like them and live in self-delusion. If you're cheating, own up to it (not to her, to yourself). Nothing wrong with that.
Monogamy and/or Cheating - Moma - 10-21-2011
Quote: (10-21-2011 09:36 AM)Gmac Wrote:
If you AGREE to be exclusive with a girl, it's cheating any way you look at it. Rationalize it however you want, you'll still be wrong. Women do that shit, don't be like them and live in self-delusion. If you're cheating, own up to it (not to her, to yourself). Nothing wrong with that.
Ah yes, Gmac raises a valid point. If you practise emotional infidelity, then you have in essence cheated on your lizard and then you might as well go through with the physical infidelity aussi.
Monogamy and/or Cheating - Chewbacon - 10-21-2011
the last thing i'd want to be is a rationalizing hamster woman.
Monogamy and/or Cheating - tenderman100 - 10-22-2011
Face the reality, and face it right now.
Women are hypergamous and, therefore, women have a tendency to cheat with "the next best man."
Men are polygamous and, therefore, have a tendency to fuck women other than their girlfriends or spouses.
THIS is the reality. Society can suppress it, cultural "norms" can devalue it, and individuals can make pledges to avoid it and, in fact may succeed for extended periods of time.....
....but evolutionary reality rules.
It ruled yesterday, it ruled now, it will rule for quite some time to come.
Monogamy and/or Cheating - Neo - 10-22-2011
If you're dating a girl you're going to be tempted no matter what. She can be the hottest girl and give you mind blowing sex every time and you'll still want to bang other girls.
I can tell you this from previous experience. Don't let your game atrophy one bit. Even if I'm with a girl who I am exclusive with, I STILL practice approach game. I don't tell her about it, but I do it. Why? Because I want to keep my game sharp. Girls can change their minds like that, I've been in the situation of dating a girl, breaking up and then having to start from zero. You don't have to keep racking in numbers/dates/or lays(whether you want to depends on your morals), but flirt, be social, and never stop improving.
Monogamy and/or Cheating - mofo - 10-22-2011
You need to choose.
Monogamy and/or Cheating - Gmac - 10-22-2011
...
Monogamy and/or Cheating - MikeCF - 10-22-2011
When you work a lot of hours, a girlfriend is nice. It's steady, reliable sex. If you run your pimp hand hard, it's mostly drama free and inexpensive, too.
You should always be running game when you have time, and if a chance to hook up with another girl arises, you should do it.
If you're not working mad hours and are with only one woman....then you may as well be a woman. Check out Oprah or some other appropriate website.
Monogamy and/or Cheating - MikeCF - 10-22-2011
Quote: (10-21-2011 09:36 AM)Gmac Wrote:
If you AGREE to be exclusive with a girl, it's cheating any way you look at it. Rationalize it however you want, you'll still be wrong. Women do that shit, don't be like them and live in self-delusion. If you're cheating, own up to it (not to her, to yourself). Nothing wrong with that.
Yep. Guys are being pussies. The cognitive dissonance is too much for their weak minds.
I cheat. Oh well. Am I supposed to feel bad about that or something?
Most of these guys need to get this fucking slave morality out of their heads.
Whom does fidelity benefit? It sure doesn't benefit a player.
Stop living by the rules that slaves live by.
Monogamy and/or Cheating - DLuzhin - 10-22-2011
Quote: (10-22-2011 05:42 PM)MikeCF Wrote:
Quote: (10-21-2011 09:36 AM)Gmac Wrote:
If you AGREE to be exclusive with a girl, it's cheating any way you look at it. Rationalize it however you want, you'll still be wrong. Women do that shit, don't be like them and live in self-delusion. If you're cheating, own up to it (not to her, to yourself). Nothing wrong with that.
Yep. Guys are being pussies. The cognitive dissonance is too much for their weak minds.
I cheat. Oh well. Am I supposed to feel bad about that or something?
Most of these guys need to get this fucking slave morality out of their heads.
Whom does fidelity benefit? It sure doesn't benefit a player.
Stop living by the rules that slaves live by.
Though I love the great moustached one, he would say that a man who is unchoosy and grabs for whatever little pleasure, whatever little trifling forms of validation that are available to him, does so out of inner weakness and lack of self-sufficiency. Though he certainly loathed human beings who became passionate about only the things they have been indoctrinated with, like traditional ideas of love or morality, he loathed even more the man incapable of restraint and sublimation.
In an early aphorism in Daybreak, [Nietzsche] comments, "One should distinguish well: whoever still wants to gain the consciousness of power will use any means... He, however, who has it, will become very choosy and noble in his tastes." In a section "What is Noble" in Beyond Good and Evil, he makes it very clear that it is human excellence he is defending and not mere self-indulgence and licentiousness.-The Blackwell Guide to Continental Philosophy
Monogamy and/or Cheating - MikeCF - 10-22-2011
Quote: (10-22-2011 07:24 PM)DLuzhin Wrote:
Though I love the great moustached one, he would say that a man who is unchoosy and grabs for whatever little pleasure, whatever little trifling forms of validation that are available to him, does so out of inner weakness and lack of self-sufficiency. Though he certainly loathed human beings who became passionate about only the things they have been indoctrinated with, like traditional ideas of love or morality, he loathed even more the man incapable of restraint and sublimation.
In an early aphorism in Daybreak, [Nietzsche] comments, "One should distinguish well: whoever still wants to gain the consciousness of power will use any means... He, however, who has it, will become very choosy and noble in his tastes." In a section "What is Noble" in Beyond Good and Evil, he makes it very clear that it is human excellence he is defending and not mere self-indulgence and licentiousness.-The Blackwell Guide to Continental Philosophy
Fortunately it's not scripture, so there's no need to follow text.
Though even following text, one might say, "OK. Then I'll only bang hot girls."
Which, incidentally, is my approach.
Monogamy and/or Cheating - Caligula - 10-22-2011
Quote: (10-22-2011 07:24 PM)DLuzhin Wrote:
Quote: (10-22-2011 05:42 PM)MikeCF Wrote:
Quote: (10-21-2011 09:36 AM)Gmac Wrote:
If you AGREE to be exclusive with a girl, it's cheating any way you look at it. Rationalize it however you want, you'll still be wrong. Women do that shit, don't be like them and live in self-delusion. If you're cheating, own up to it (not to her, to yourself). Nothing wrong with that.
Yep. Guys are being pussies. The cognitive dissonance is too much for their weak minds.
I cheat. Oh well. Am I supposed to feel bad about that or something?
Most of these guys need to get this fucking slave morality out of their heads.
Whom does fidelity benefit? It sure doesn't benefit a player.
Stop living by the rules that slaves live by.
Though I love the great moustached one, he would say that a man who is unchoosy and grabs for whatever little pleasure, whatever little trifling forms of validation that are available to him, does so out of inner weakness and lack of self-sufficiency. Though he certainly loathed human beings who became passionate about only the things they have been indoctrinated with, like traditional ideas of love or morality, he loathed even more the man incapable of restraint and sublimation.
In an early aphorism in Daybreak, [Nietzsche] comments, "One should distinguish well: whoever still wants to gain the consciousness of power will use any means... He, however, who has it, will become very choosy and noble in his tastes." In a section "What is Noble" in Beyond Good and Evil, he makes it very clear that it is human excellence he is defending and not mere self-indulgence and licentiousness.-The Blackwell Guide to Continental Philosophy
Besides the point. Being picky and fucking around are not mutually exclusive.
Slave morality would have everyone dragged down to the level of the least successful. To paraphrase Nietzsche: the beta, by saying that his monogamy is voluntary, avoids facing the uncomfortable truth that it is imposed on him by his lack of options. It is imposed on him by his fear of not being able to do better. The masses don't have options. Because of this they will try to stop you from exercising your own hard won options.
Slave morality is pessimistic and cynical. It's all around us. It smothers excellence and seeks to drag you down to the lowest common denominator. It is embodied in the sarcastic, snivelling beta who cockblocks you. It is perpetuated by your beta friend who secretly denigrates your womanizing because he isn't getting laid. It is perpetuated by the woman of poor character who can't get you to commit to her by her own qualities.
The beta tries to impose his monogamy on his betters, to make fidelity a universal value. To force everyone to join him in his wretched existence. It's the only means the weak have to impose their will on the strong. The poor on the rich. The unattractive on the attractive. Learn to recognise this kind of thinking and avoid its proponents.
If you have the means to fuck around, do it. Recognise why people believe the things they do and realise that they probably don't apply to you.
Apart from this Nietzsche had some keen insights about the sexes. Take a look at the aphorisms on women in The Gay Science and Human, All Too Human.
Monogamy and/or Cheating - Neo - 10-23-2011
Quote: (10-22-2011 05:23 PM)Gmac Wrote:
Once your game reaches a certain level it won't be about going out to "practice doing approaches" but rather just keeping your internalized mind sharp -- spending too much time with one women often makes you lazy and complacent. It's interesting how your way of thinking about game changes and becomes so natural. You stop thinking about game at all because it becomes just an extension of your personality.
2. I felt guilty but I knew I was getting mine and getting away with it. I'm selfish and won't deny it. My biggest problem with cheating on a really good girl was the idea of giving her an undeserved STD somewhere down the line. It was one of the main reasons I broke up with my last girlfriend of 6 months.
It's still ongoing practice. To maintain any skill there is a commitment to continuing to do the work that got you to that level to begin with, even if it's not consciously thought of anymore. But I agree over time, game becomes an extension of who you are.
#2 was always my concern as well. I consider it morally wrong to give a girl an STD when she's being loyal in the relationship. I wouldn't wish that on anyone. I mean shit if I get it's one thing, but I wouldn't want to jeopardize someone else's health because I rawdogged a slut without a condom.
Monogamy and/or Cheating - DLuzhin - 10-23-2011
Quote: (10-22-2011 07:45 PM)MikeCF Wrote:
Quote: (10-22-2011 07:24 PM)DLuzhin Wrote:
Though I love the great moustached one, he would say that a man who is unchoosy and grabs for whatever little pleasure, whatever little trifling forms of validation that are available to him, does so out of inner weakness and lack of self-sufficiency. Though he certainly loathed human beings who became passionate about only the things they have been indoctrinated with, like traditional ideas of love or morality, he loathed even more the man incapable of restraint and sublimation.
In an early aphorism in Daybreak, [Nietzsche] comments, "One should distinguish well: whoever still wants to gain the consciousness of power will use any means... He, however, who has it, will become very choosy and noble in his tastes." In a section "What is Noble" in Beyond Good and Evil, he makes it very clear that it is human excellence he is defending and not mere self-indulgence and licentiousness.-The Blackwell Guide to Continental Philosophy
Fortunately it's not scripture, so there's no need to follow text.
Though even following text, one might say, "OK. Then I'll only bang hot girls."
Which, incidentally, is my approach.
Living up to the agreements you make with yourself and others, and honoring the ideals of your own creation, is the great source of power. For most this would mean ending a monogamous relationship rather than messing around outside of it. To each his own.