Ideas for Improving Trip Reports - Printable Version
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Ideas for Improving Trip Reports - Robert Plant - 08-01-2017
Many people on this board think that giving out information about locations can ruin a place and cause it to be overrun with “wannabe players”. While it might be an exaggeration to say places get ruined due to trip reports, I do think if too many details are given, it can cause a place to get over-hyped and hurt the atmosphere of that place (e.g. Bangkok & Makati). On the other hand, trip reports are valuable when you travel and enjoyable to read.
Some new guidelines would keep trip reports informative but avoid all the hype. I suggest:
We keep providing good general information such as…
-Places to stay with good logistics
-Good date places
-Location specific game techniques
-Cool things to do
-Good places/ aps for game in that location.
We STOP hyping places up by…
-Talking about how easy it is. Every place has challenges.
-Being unrealistic about the girls. Women everywhere have their pluses and minuses.
-Mentioning notch counts (e.g. 8 lays in 6 days).
-Mentioning and posting photos of specific girls/ specific sexual experiences.
If you really need to talk about your notch count/ specific girls, please put it in the players log/lounge. Let’s keep the trip reports informative but avoid the hype.
Please feel free to comment and add other suggestions.
Ideas for Improving Trip Reports - rudebwoy - 08-01-2017
You do know this board gets thousand of lurkers!
Why would you divulge a place you have been too, if it was good to you.
Somebody already did a solid report on a place I was well received and others are talking about going there as well now.
Ideas for Improving Trip Reports - Robert Plant - 08-01-2017
The point is people do divulge information. I want guys to stop giving too much information.
Ideas for Improving Trip Reports - kirdiesel - 08-01-2017
Quote: (08-01-2017 10:51 AM)rudebwoy Wrote:
You do know this board gets thousand of lurkers!
Why would you divulge a place you have been too, if it was good to you.
Somebody already did a solid report on a place I was well received and others are talking about going there as well now.
Because it could be helpful to other American black guys looking for a place to go. I think back to myself and my situation in the US wondering if there was anything better out there or this was it.. I was thankful to be given the opportunity to get out. As American black men there isn't really that much support and resources out there for us. So if I can contribute something and possibly inspire one of us to travel and experience something else I am gonna do it.
I am 100% forthcoming with my data. I don't see 10,000 American black guys moving from the US to Oslo, Rotterdam or Cologne and ruining it because of a datasheet.
Keep the hype out of it and keep the data as unbiased as possible.
Before I moved to Germany there was tons of hype around this country and I would say there is some truth to it but the majority of it is unfounded.
The hype def doesn't match the results since everyone is different and looks different. Reading some of the sheets.. some guys are stronger on Tinder, some guys are stronger in day/night game and some guys are not strong in either. I am also not sure how a place can be named a pussy paradise if you have to rely on Tinder for the majority of your bangs but alot of times in this place a bang is a bang no matter where it comes from or how ugly the girl is.
Ideas for Improving Trip Reports - germanico - 08-01-2017
Adding "in my experience" before any statement about the quality of girls from said place.
Ideas for Improving Trip Reports - rudebwoy - 08-01-2017
^Valid points.
Many people pm for info and I am always happy to share based on "my" experience.
I have posted before you joined the forum and a certain segment doesn't want to hear about black guys doing well in a certain place.
Yes, we are ALL different and going to have different experiences.
Ideas for Improving Trip Reports - DarkTriad - 08-01-2017
Quote: (08-01-2017 10:51 AM)rudebwoy Wrote:
You do know this board gets thousand of lurkers!
Why would you divulge a place you have been too, if it was good to you.
Somebody already did a solid report on a place I was well received and others are talking about going there as well now.
Restrict trip reports to the Private Lounge if they're real unkown gems?
Ideas for Improving Trip Reports - rudebwoy - 08-01-2017
^That is a good idea, but it isn't my forum.
Ideas for Improving Trip Reports - Laner - 08-01-2017
We go through this every couple of years.
The reality is that every guy here has a different experience.
When that happens, the OP's of the Data Sheets get ripped apart. So there is no real winner in this, but posting sheets is a huge part of the culture here and most guys read them and like them.
Ideas for Improving Trip Reports - godzilla - 08-01-2017
I usually don't trust anything I read in the trip reports. Though Ill admit, they can be pretty helpful when it comes to finding a good place to go on the weekdays (especially when I was in Latin America). For all the posts about Szimpla Kert in Budapest, Gringo Tuesdays in Bogota, Lola Lolita in Guadalajara, Red Bar in Buenos Aires, Coco's in Krakow, all these places were fun as shit, full of girls, and have been widely posted about.
I remember reading tons of reports about how Estonia was ruined, yet I thought it was awesome. Now since DN provided a sheet, you see a bunch of dudes posting in the meetup section now heading over there.
The only person you should trust is yourself, Find a country where you like the style of girls that are there and go up to them.
Ideas for Improving Trip Reports - DigitalNomad - 08-02-2017
Personally I don't think a data sheet is going to mess with a city much. If a certain sheet causes 10 people to go to the city over the span of months and months. If someone isn't getting laid at home they likely won't get laid in places I find exceptional, and beyond that the places I post about I likely won't be back to for a year or more, at which point my data sheet will fall into the archived oblivions.
I've found data sheets on here to be immensely useful, so I'm happy to give back. It is kind of the point of this part of the forum after all.
Ideas for Improving Trip Reports - goncalo999 - 08-02-2017
The more information on cities / countries, the better.. Then you choose what to use, what to retain and try, etc..
Ideas for Improving Trip Reports - Biologist - 08-02-2017
Personally, I've always thought that it would ideal to have a separate sub-forum only for travel datasheets.
In order to access the datasheet sub-forum you need to be a member who has contributed at least 2 substantial datasheets of your own - only after this you can read the rest of them.
This will ensure that people who read the datasheets have also contributed to the bank of knowledge, and it will stop the hundreds of thousands of lurkers from spoiling certain locations.
Just my 2c though...
Ideas for Improving Trip Reports - digitalconquistador - 08-02-2017
There is a specific bar in the Philippines that I sometimes go to. It's far removed from Manila, and it's very easy to get really decent girls there, even now. But it used to be absolutely insane.
I mentioned it to a few guys on this board and elsewhere, where it's located, and the following weekend there were three foreigners there. (Before that, I'd never seen any there in almost half a year.) Coincidence? Maybe. But the same thing happened weeks later after I told a few guys about another "good" location.
If telling a handful of people can cause that, imagine how much of an impact a TR with thousands of lurkers has. I've since found better bars and haven't told a soul.
Ideas for Improving Trip Reports - Robert Plant - 08-03-2017
The other night I was at a club in a big city in South America. There were tons of hot girls but there were also tons of foreign guys. To be fair this particular club is highlighted in the guidebooks as a fun place for backpackers to go but the effect is the same as when we hype places up in trip reports. Most of these guys were lower value than myself and the other forum members I was with, but the other foreign guys made it more challenging. The women there perceived that there was abundance, which I guess there was. Me and one of the other forum guys still pulled 2 good looking girls back to my apartment and on this night it happened with relative ease. But, I can imagine on other nights at this club I could struggle due the the abundance of gringos.
The evidence suggests to me that trip reports can degrade a place when they hype that place up. Again, I think it is everyone's best interest to keep the information coming but stay away from hype.
Ideas for Improving Trip Reports - Irish - 08-03-2017
I wrote up a pretty comprehensive Jakarta datasheet which I put a fair bit of effort into. It served me well initially to get a bit of rep which eventually helped me meet some of the more established members on the board. Plus I enjoyed being able to leverage my knowledge and experience from multiple trips to the city to give back to the forum, having myself benefited from reading plenty other city datasheets myself.
There's a few downsides to writing a datasheet however. First there's the need to constantly be keeping it up to date. Some places the scene can shift around fairly quickly at times with clubs dying off or closing down and new places springing up. It's not too big an effort but one that you begin to see diminishing returns from. Particularly when your datasheet then starts running into a 3, 4, 5... page thread and all the info gets spread out and is more of an effort for the reader to consolidate.
That's when you start to get all the PMs asking questions. Now I don't mind at all helping out decent guys who give you props, but often you get guys asking questions clearly already answered in the DS had they bothered their arse to read it. And more often than not you don't so much as get a thanks never mind a rep point for your efforts.
Plus I agree with Laner above where every guy will have a different experiences to the next. I'm in my late 30s and nightgame almost exclusively. I don't really bother with dates or online at all, and prefer to go to the more higher end clubs and using doing bottle service. Thus I wrote my datasheet from that perspective. What I didn't anticipate was quite how many budget tinder swipers would be showing up. To whom the vast majority of my info is not only useless, but probably misleading.
In my opinion, how to improve the quality of datasheets/trip reports when writing:
- Give a bit of a bio about yourself before hand. Details of age, experience, type of game you generally employ, length of trip, where you were staying etc etc. Guys often do this already but it bears repeating as is essential for setting the context in which to read the intel.
- When writing the datasheet, do what I didn't and try cater to a wider range of range of players. ie if you're a late 30s nightgamer who likes bottle service, try also providing some recommendations 'for the younger guys', or 'for daygamers' and some intel on online ('good 1st date venues' also etc). Even if you don't know much on these subjects, I'm sure if it's your home city you'll have some friends there you can tap up for pointers
- Try keep the datasheet relevant to providing intel on the place rather than just using it as an excuse to endlessly brag about how many chicks you're banging and what a big ass pimp you are. Nobody gives a fuck.
- Provide details of alternative sources of info which may be updated more regularly. ie for Jakarta jakarta100bars.com is excellent and is constantly being kept up to date with new info.
- Keep the datasheet relevant by occasionally dropping in an update here and there. Particularly when a new bar or club opens up etc. Only needs to be a few lines, nothing major
- If a datasheet already exists on the place, tag on your intel onto it rather than starting a whole new thread. Keeps everything in one place and saves duplication of info/effort
- Ignore the haters and the dumb ass PMs
- See it as a rough guide at best and don't take it as gospel. Seek out all sources of data you can find both on the forum and google and form an opinion on the consistencies you find between each
- Ignore all the 'I banged X chicks in Y days' bragging testimonials. It is of little to no relevance given you have no insight to the level of quality that was being banged. In my personal experience, when a dude does a high volume of chicks in a short space of time, the quality is almost always garbage anyway and the stories grossly exaggerated. Particularly when it comes from someone so concerned about keeping score and needing to constantly update strangers on the internet as to how big a pimp he is.
- Check when the datasheet was written, if it's over 6 months it's likely going to be somewhat out of date in places. Over a couple years old, it's probably not going to be too reliable. Regardless shoot the author and/or the main contributors a PM to confirm if it's all still valid, or if he has any new up to date intel.
- When PMing guys for info:
- obviously make sure to read the full datasheet thread first. If its a gazillion page thread however, then it's probably quite old anyway - so just skim through the start and focus more on the last couple pages where the info will be more recent/relevant. Put in the effort and do you research on the place first (using both RVF and google) so you are already somewhat clued up. Don't be one of these morons who asks a bunch of stupid questions which have already been answered multiple times on the forum already.
- Kick off by giving props where due to the intel already provided, the author appreciates that his work is providing value to others.
- Let him know when you're planning on going and other relevant info such as age, experience, style of game, budget etc as well as other things you're keen on doing outside of chasing skirt. That way you provide some context and he can provide some specifically tailored advice for you
- Most guys are more than happy to help, give value and demonstrate how much they know about a place. Particularly when their contributions to the forum are openly appreciated. However, don't expect the guy to write you a personalised 10 page dossier on every single element about your trip. Do your research and try keep your questions relevant and specific
- Don't ask stupid ass questions like 'where do I go that I'll be banging 9s every night for no effort and doesn't blow my $16.73 a day budget?'
- and of course, don't be a parasite. If the info was helpful to you, give a rep point. - Afterwards provide a brief testimonial on the DS thread of your trip also. Rather than regurgitating info already laid out, outline what places you found to be the best and any new spots not previously mentioned. Give credit where it's due where the guy helped out out over PM also.
I did a bit of an experiment: Last year a new bar burst on the scene in Jakarta called Basque which from the off was an absolute goldmine for skirt. Even though it was really a pre-game venue, it was even better for picking up than the actual clubs and was my #1 spot hands down for a good 9 months or so. I deliberately didn't mention anything on the forum, partly cos I was tired with being told to 'STFU about Jakarta' cos I'm apparently going to spoil the place (ironically this coming from dudes who admitted they would never ever have set foot there in the first place had it not been for my DS) and partly as an experiment on the “lurker effect”. Some guys were convinced the moment you tipped off a decent place on the forum the very next day it would be bursting with forum lurkers. I was skeptical. But I kept it off the forum anyway and instead only divulged it my inner circle of RVF friends or members who had directly PM'd me asking where to go.
Never in my life have I seen a place go downhill so badly in such a short timeframe as Basque did in the last 6 months. This is despite it not once being mentioned on the forum until relatively recently, long after the place had already fallen. What was once an absolute goldmine is now packed to the gills with thirsty tourist sausage, some of whom are prepared to fight you to the death for a 6. And unsurprisingly the vast majority of the half decent talent has long since been scared off. Leaving us just with the standard issue B-league, bottlerat and tinderella chicks to get their attention fix off the thirsty hoard. (well it's not got quite that bad yet but you get the picture...)
So make of that what you will, but to me I don't think the lurker effect is that significant. If it was, then all of Jakarta EXCEPT Basque would've been destroyed long ago. Sure there's tonnes of lurkers on here, but in reality only a small % of them will have the time, cash and incentive/balls to make the trip. And even then it'll only be for a week or two. And besides, I've made a number of good buddies from guys who've come to Jakarta and got in touch. (Tho I've also had to deal with my fair share of weirdos and assholes also...)
Now that said, it may be the case that certain destinations which are more accessible to the US and UK are a lot more affected by what's written here. Seeing with my own eyes the unbelievable level of spam approach daygame burning up places in EE was quite a shock for example. Tho I would lay the 'blame' for that more down to the popular London daygame blogs and forums (tho I highly doubt they could've forseen the effect it would've had). But also hearing how some of the old school Bangkok regulars wax lyrical about how 'the good old days' are long gone does makes me wonder also.
Still tho, it was the trip reports and datasheets who brought me to RVF in the first place. And writing datasheets of my own led me to meeting plenty of cool dudes who got in touch and came to visit. Many of whom have become close friends. It has become part of the culture here and separates RVF from the more one dimensional game focused forums. I certainly wouldn't be encouraging withholding info from the forum.
What isn't being mentioned here is that a fair amount of quality intel is actually already getting shared privately between repped/vetted members who are regularly in touch anyway. Usually via various inner circle style group chats and whatnot. Rather than splurge everything onto the forum in datasheets, often we share it between ourselves and only later as it becomes wider known it makes its way onto the forum. The only way to get privvy to this intel is to stop being a lurker, contribute back to the forum, get a bit of rep for it and get out there and meet dudes....just make sure you're not an asshole. or a weirdo...
![[Image: icon_mrgreen.gif]](https://rooshvforum.network/images/smilies/new/icon_mrgreen.gif){kind=icon}
Ideas for Improving Trip Reports - Dream Medicine - 09-12-2017
Irish's awesome post above is a must-read, and well-deserving of a 'sticky' at the top of the travel section. If both readers and writers alike took it to heart the quality of reporting here would improve massively.
![[Image: giphy.gif]](https://media.giphy.com/media/Z6ozPzOyEIaB2/giphy.gif)
Edit: P.S. He also inspired me to explore a related topic here: "Investigating the reliability of pickup claims online; was the bang really that easy?"
Ideas for Improving Trip Reports - MongolianAbroad - 09-24-2017
Quote: (08-03-2017 09:45 AM)Irish Wrote:
What isn't being mentioned here is that a fair amount of quality intel is actually already getting shared privately between repped/vetted members who are regularly in touch anyway. Usually via various inner circle style group chats and whatnot. Rather than splurge everything onto the forum in datasheets, often we share it between ourselves and only later as it becomes wider known it makes its way onto the forum. The only way to get privvy to this intel is to stop being a lurker, contribute back to the forum, get a bit of rep for it and get out there and meet dudes....just make sure you're not an asshole. or a weirdo...
I'm waiting for the moment someone reads this and thinks, "Damn, I was about to reach out and meet dudes, too bad I'm an asshole AND a weirdo, so much for that idea."